Page 8 • Book recommendation (sci-fi) • Non-Gaming • Books • Eurogamer.net

President_Weasel 16 Jun 2010 16:28:42 12,355 posts
Seen 2 weeks ago
Registered 17 years ago

glaeken wrote:

w00t wrote:
Everything I've read by Adam Roberts is great - almost thought experiments, rather than straight science fiction.

Hmm not too sure on Roberts. I initially thought he was great as he is very good writer for a Sci-Fi writer but the last couple of books I have read of his were not great. Splinter and Swiftly. When I say not great I feel overall the stories were not satisfying though there is decent writing in both.

Some of his early stuff was really good though. Salt, On and PolyStom I think are excellent.

He is an interesting writer though as he really does seem to make a real effect to do something different in each of his books.

I disagree. I think he's a hack who takes a gimmicky idea and spins it out into a quickly-written book. The library is full of 'Salt' and 'On' and 'Snow' and 'Stuff' and 'Thing'.
Also the central gimmick in 'On' is fucking stupid.

otto Moderator 16 Jun 2010 16:32:39 49,322 posts
Seen 2 weeks ago
Registered 20 years ago

localnotail wrote:
Which ones did you read? I really liked everything I've read apart from Falling Out Of cars, which was just ok. Vurt was realy nicely trippy I thought, and the others in that series. And I liked the remix stuff he did with Needle in the Groove.

I read several of them, I can't remember. Vurt was definitely one, and there were at least two others. It was quite a long time ago. They were OK, not that bad. I remember one involving psychotropic curry. Then another one involving some kind of sex doll which was much less interesting than you'd expect.

glaeken 16 Jun 2010 17:05:19 12,070 posts
Seen 7 months ago
Registered 17 years ago

President Weasel wrote:

glaeken wrote:

w00t wrote:
Everything I've read by Adam Roberts is great - almost thought experiments, rather than straight science fiction.

Hmm not too sure on Roberts. I initially thought he was great as he is very good writer for a Sci-Fi writer but the last couple of books I have read of his were not great. Splinter and Swiftly. When I say not great I feel overall the stories were not satisfying though there is decent writing in both.

Some of his early stuff was really good though. Salt, On and PolyStom I think are excellent.

He is an interesting writer though as he really does seem to make a real effect to do something different in each of his books.

I disagree. I think he's a hack who takes a gimmicky idea and spins it out into a quickly-written book. The library is full of 'Salt' and 'On' and 'Snow' and 'Stuff' and 'Thing'.
Also the central gimmick in 'On' is fucking stupid.

I quite like the gimmick in On. It is of course stupid but its pretty original. I don't actually mind a gimmick that has no basis in any real science as long as the author can run with it and give me a story I enjoy.

I don't really get the hack comment as I think his books are well written and thought out in general. He does go for gimmicky one word titles and does tend to spin a book around a single concept but in general they have worked for me. He does knock his books out at quite a rate though so I guess that might meet the hack label.

I would actually say what put me off him a bit was his books some times feel like literary exercises and it seems whatever he happens to be aiming at he looses site of the fact a book should at least entertain on some level.

Our opposite opinions on Abercrombie and Morgan probably show we have fairly different tastes on this type of thing though

President_Weasel 16 Jun 2010 17:22:48 12,355 posts
Seen 2 weeks ago
Registered 17 years ago

On and Snow are among the very few books that have simultaneously kept me reading and kept me annoyed at the same time. I'd go so far to say he must be a decent writer if I can be angry at his book yet still want to read to the end. However I do like to have some science in my sci-fi; either based in hard science or set far enough in the future to allow 'indisinguishable from magic' type science. Some of Roberts's setups are a bit too close to waving his hands and going "a wizard did it" for me to enjoy them - getting to the end of "On" and thinking "well that was just stupid" made me decide not to bother with his books any more.

However I'd say we had similar opinions on Abercrombie and Morgan, I thought we both liked both the authors, just disagreed on their relative positions in our scales of likeyness.

glaeken 16 Jun 2010 17:38:16 12,070 posts
Seen 7 months ago
Registered 17 years ago

Adams is very much on the brink of Sci-Fi and fantasy so I can see where you are coming from. He certainly does not seem to value connecting all the dots up in his science. He sort of comes from the Lost school of Sci-Fi writing were the mystery is more important than the explanation. I don't actually mind that approach these days though I used to be a bit of a hard Sci-Fi Nazi. I think I have mellowed in my old age and can accept the output of wishy washy creative types

Yeah I think on Abercrombie and Morgan we just had varying views on where their stars currently are vis a vi assention/dessention. Reading back now I see we actually look to generally agree.

President_Weasel 16 Jun 2010 18:28:47 12,355 posts
Seen 2 weeks ago
Registered 17 years ago

glaeken wrote:
Adams is very much on the brink of Sci-Fi and fantasy so I can see where you are coming from. He certainly does not seem to value connecting all the dots up in his science. He sort of comes from the Lost school of Sci-Fi writing were the mystery is more important than the explanation. I don't actually mind that approach these days though I used to be a bit of a hard Sci-Fi Nazi. I think I have mellowed in my old age and can accept the output of wishy washy creative types

Yeah I think on Abercrombie and Morgan we just had varying views on where their stars currently are vis a vi assention/dessention. Reading back now I see we actually look to generally agree.

That's where we differ. Lost irked me immensely, it seemed so obvious that not only were they just making it up as they went along and relying on coming up with "a wizard did it" in series 6 but also they weren't even trying to hide it. Unlike you I have grown less mellow in my old age, but I take comfort in the fact that every sale of a soft, barely sci-fi. sci-fi author like Roberts makes purchasing editors at publishers think "hmm, maybe there's money in sci-fi this year" and increases the chance of more sci-fi-ier authors getting a book deal.
It's a big library after all, and there's room for Roberts in it. I just won't be pciking up his books

I quite liked "Flood" by Stephen Baxter even though the premise is almost as ridiculous as On. He did at least seem to be trying to avoid "a science wizard did it" though.

PearOfAnguish 16 Jun 2010 18:29:14 7,573 posts
Seen 6 years ago
Registered 17 years ago

coastal wrote:
any sci-fi WWII book recommendations?

Harry Turtledove's World War series is about aliens invading during WW2. That is entertaining fluff - barring a few irritating characters and plot turns - with lots of action. If that series isn't quite silly or action-packed enough for you then there's Weapons of Choice, which is about a future(ish) carrier group being dropped into the battle of Midway. It's fast paced and violent and has lots of military hardware so if you like mindless carnage and sexy guns that's worth a go. There are worse holiday books, though I was hoping it was some kind of alternate history meta-novel about what would happen if Tom Clancy was a SF author.

Magic_Thighs wrote:
Interesting list. Read the top 5 and about 30 others. No GAP series by Mr Donaldson though? Shameful

Sensible. The Gap series is rubbish.

President_Weasel 16 Jun 2010 19:54:19 12,355 posts
Seen 2 weeks ago
Registered 17 years ago

PearOfAnguish wrote:

coastal wrote:
any sci-fi WWII book recommendations?

Harry Turtledove's World War series is about aliens invading during WW2. That is entertaining fluff - barring a few irritating characters and plot turns - with lots of action. If that series isn't quite silly or action-packed enough for you then there's Weapons of Choice, which is about a future(ish) carrier group being dropped into the battle of Midway. It's fast paced and violent and has lots of military hardware so if you like mindless carnage and sexy guns that's worth a go. There are worse holiday books, though I was hoping it was some kind of alternate history meta-novel about what would happen if Tom Clancy was a SF author.

Magic_Thighs wrote:
Interesting list. Read the top 5 and about 30 others. No GAP series by Mr Donaldson though? Shameful

Sensible. The Gap series is rubbish.

I think my favourite thing about the Weapons of Choice series was the way the 2020s personnel had been affected by a couple of decades of the War on Terror, so they weren't just cuddly enlightened nowadays folks going back to the 1940s. Not a bad set of books, although a tad airport-novely.

The Gap series was terrible. Pear is correct. Seemed like a half-assed idea that he'd just run with for want of a better inspiration (Ring Cycle but in space? fuck it, that'll do).

PearOfAnguish 16 Jun 2010 21:25:43 7,573 posts
Seen 6 years ago
Registered 17 years ago

I haven't read the sequels yet, but don't they later feature Prince Harry having a throwdown with some Nazis?

Scimarad 16 Jun 2010 21:27:55 9,964 posts
Seen 14 hours ago
Registered 18 years ago

I actually quite liked those books, including the aforementioned Harry bit

phAge 16 Jun 2010 21:50:25 25,487 posts
Seen 3 weeks ago
Registered 18 years ago

PearOfAnguish wrote:

coastal wrote:
any sci-fi WWII book recommendations?

Harry Turtledove's World War series is about aliens invading during WW2. That is entertaining fluff - barring a few irritating characters and plot turns - with lots of action. If that series isn't quite silly or action-packed enough for you then there's Weapons of Choice, which is about a future(ish) carrier group being dropped into the battle of Midway. It's fast paced and violent and has lots of military hardware so if you like mindless carnage and sexy guns that's worth a go. There are worse holiday books, though I was hoping it was some kind of alternate history meta-novel about what would happen if Tom Clancy was a SF author.

Magic_Thighs wrote:
Interesting list. Read the top 5 and about 30 others. No GAP series by Mr Donaldson though? Shameful

Sensible. The Gap series is rubbish.

World War series can fuck right off. First 2-3 books are OK, but after that it turns into Eastenders with about as much action.

Also, leave your disbelief firmly at home: space-travelling alien tanks getting knocked out by WW2-era German tanks, yeaaaah...

EDIT: World War 2.0 series (of which Weapons of Choice is the first) is OK - not exactly high litterature, though - and it is frustrating how they don't just smash the fuck outta the Nazis and be done with it.

phAge 16 Jun 2010 21:53:26 25,487 posts
Seen 3 weeks ago
Registered 18 years ago

PearOfAnguish wrote:
I haven't read the sequels yet, but don't they later feature Prince Harry having a throwdown with some Nazis?

Otto Skorzeny - who is funnily enough also a prominent-ish character in Turtledove's books.

PearOfAnguish 16 Jun 2010 22:21:46 7,573 posts
Seen 6 years ago
Registered 17 years ago

phAge wrote:
World War series can fuck right off. First 2-3 books are OK, but after that it turns into Eastenders with about as much action.

That's the follow-up, Colonisation. World War (first four) has plenty of shooty bang.

Also, leave your disbelief firmly at home: space-travelling alien tanks getting knocked out by WW2-era German tanks, yeaaaah...

I think he did a pretty good job of handling that by making clear that they only innovate when it's necessary, their tanks are vulnerable because they've never come up against anything that shoots back. If you can't get past that then you're going to struggle with a series about alien lizards fighting Nazis.

Nanocrystal 16 Jun 2010 23:29:53 2,575 posts
Seen 5 hours ago
Registered 12 years ago

Just skimmed through this thread and I don't *think* anyone mentioned Dan Simmons' Hyperion. Definitely the best sci-fi novel I've ever read. The three sequels are good too. Ilium and Olympos were pretty cool as well. The Terror was just incredible, up until the ending, where it went to shit IMHO.

I will second the recommendations for Watts' Blindsight too. Has a lot of really interesting ideas crammed in, and the guy clearly knows his science.

Oh, and I loved the Night's Dawn Trilogy. Didn't have any problem with the sex in it, though I was a horny fifteen year old at the time.

spindizzy 16 Jun 2010 23:49:35 7,755 posts
Seen 3 weeks ago
Registered 17 years ago

redcrayon wrote:

localnotail wrote:
Following recommendations from EG (thanks) I've just read 3 books by Michael Marshall Smith: Only Forward, Spares, and One of Us.

I should probably have spaced them out a bit but I binged them, which is a shame because I don't think I really gave them enough time to properly savour them. They are pretty good, I thought. Nice sense of humour, inventive plots and compelling characters. Plus he shares my obsessions with smoking. And cats.

I think Only Forward is the best so far. I think he might have even better stories in him though.

I really enjoyed Spares. One thing I found quite odd is that it's set up at the start (and by the title!) that the 'spares' and the ethics surrounding them are going to be the core of the book, and then it all goes a bit wierd with the 'other' dimension, and loses the focus on them.

I loved Michael Marshall Smith, and I see from his website that he's mainly a thriller writer now. I find this a bit sad, as he was wonderfully inventive at sf, but perhaps I should check one of them out.

http://www.michaelmarshallsmith.com/index.html

phAge 17 Jun 2010 08:18:26 25,487 posts
Seen 3 weeks ago
Registered 18 years ago

Nanocrystal wrote:
Just skimmed through this thread and I don't *think* anyone mentioned Dan Simmons' Hyperion. Definitely the best sci-fi novel I've ever read. The three sequels are good too. Ilium and Olympos were pretty cool as well. The Terror was just incredible, up until the ending, where it went to shit IMHO.

I will second the recommendations for Watts' Blindsight too. Has a lot of really interesting ideas crammed in, and the guy clearly knows his science.

Oh, and I loved the Night's Dawn Trilogy. Didn't have any problem with the sex in it, though I was a horny fifteen year old at the time.

Mr. Simmons does have a tendency to go all metaphysical/philosophical towards the end of his novels, yes. Was particularly annoying, as you say, in The Terror. Even so, it was the first book which actually made me feel physically cold - his descriptions of the environment are breathtaking.

Deleted user 17 June 2010 08:19:22

PearOfAnguish wrote:

Magic_Thighs wrote:
Interesting list. Read the top 5 and about 30 others. No GAP series by Mr Donaldson though? Shameful

Sensible. The Gap series is rubbish.

Well they say opinions are like arseholes

Deleted user 17 June 2010 08:20:57

No insult meant btw, different opinions and all that. I'm probably coloured as I started reading Donaldson (Thomas Convenant series) when I was 11

President_Weasel 17 Jun 2010 12:40:34 12,355 posts
Seen 2 weeks ago
Registered 17 years ago

I liked the Covenant books, and the ones with the mirrors. Daughter of Regals was good too.
Gap was arse though, and I didn't even bother with his yet another series of Covenant books. Shame, really.

Deleted user 18 June 2010 00:59:16

PearOfAnguish wrote:

phAge wrote:
World War series can fuck right off. First 2-3 books are OK, but after that it turns into Eastenders with about as much action.

That's the follow-up, Colonisation. World War (first four) has plenty of shooty bang.

Also, leave your disbelief firmly at home: space-travelling alien tanks getting knocked out by WW2-era German tanks, yeaaaah...

I think he did a pretty good job of handling that by making clear that they only innovate when it's necessary, their tanks are vulnerable because they've never come up against anything that shoots back. If you can't get past that then you're going to struggle with a series about alien lizards fighting Nazis.

I loved the World War series. Colonisation is a bit crap, but the book that rounds it all off, Homeward Bound, does a good job of tieing up the loose ends.

If I recall correctly, the lizard fleet turned up ready to pacify a world stuck in dark age technology, intending to shock humanity into joining the empire in a matter of weeks. They didn't have the capacity to fight countries that were turning out hundreds of tanks a month and developing nuclear weapons, even with a 10-1 casualty rate, nor did they have factories to replace their losses, or any understanding of human concepts like suicide weapons, insurgency, outright lieing and sacrificial units.

The lizard fleetlord, Atvar, is my favourite character in the books for the journey he undertakes- utterly naive to human politics, but by the later books he's turned into an utter cynic, with nothing surprising him any more.

Deleted user 18 June 2010 01:04:17

spindizzy wrote:

I loved Michael Marshall Smith, and I see from his website that he's mainly a thriller writer now. I find this a bit sad, as he was wonderfully inventive at sf, but perhaps I should check one of them out.

http://www.michaelmarshallsmith.com/index.html

The Straw Men trilogy are the only ones I've read, serial killer pulpy stuff. I didn't enjoy them as much as his Sci-fi, as there's little in them that hasn't been done before and better. Good holiday reads though.

pauleyc 18 Jun 2010 09:45:11 4,548 posts
Seen 16 hours ago
Registered 20 years ago

As far as militaristic sci-fi is concerned, I quite liked Jack Campbell's The Lost Fleet cycle. It's not as engaging as Old Man's War but way better than Walter Jon Williams' Dread Empire's Fall. Campbell manages to give at least the main protagonist more depth - a rather surprising feat for space opera and pleasant change from the usual cardboard cut-outs.

Speaking of WJW - I really recommend Aristoi, his cyberpunk Hardwired series is also nice.

gammonbanter 19 Jun 2010 13:40:58 2,282 posts
Seen 7 hours ago
Registered 14 years ago

I'm reading Arthur C's Childhood's End at the moment and loving every word of it! You can see loads of Hollywood films in the first 2 chapters alone!

Oh-Bollox 19 Jun 2010 23:21:35 6,513 posts
Seen 2 years ago
Registered 14 years ago

President Weasel wrote:
I liked the Covenant books, and the ones with the mirrors.

Mordant's Need. Quality pair of books.

Deleted user 20 June 2010 00:05:24

I have lately been reading books that would normally be qualified as 'Fantasy' but are actually set in a super far future Earth so 'magic' is actually super-high-tech.

Michael Moorcock - Dancers at the End of Time
Gene Wolfe - Book of the New Sun sequence

I find both to be 'excellent stuff'

PearOfAnguish 20 Jun 2010 00:11:16 7,573 posts
Seen 6 years ago
Registered 17 years ago

gammonbanter wrote:
I'm reading Arthur C's Childhood's End at the moment and loving every word of it! You can see loads of Hollywood films in the first 2 chapters alone!

It is a brilliant book, his best ever for me. It's not aged too badly either, which is fairly staggering when you see when it was written.

If you like the singularity theme then Vernor Vinge should be up your street, Fire Upon the Deep and Marooned in Realtime are fantastic.

Jetset_UK 30 Jun 2010 11:23:34 3,578 posts
Seen 2 years ago
Registered 18 years ago

spindizzy wrote:

Also, if anyone likes ultra violent, fast paced, far future space opera - anything by Neal Asher is going to make you very happy indeed. I think he's slightly running out of ideas now, but Spatterjay is a fantastic creation, and the Prador are wonderfully nasty.

Picked up 'Gridlinked' a week or so ago based on your recommendation, and really enjoyed it, have just ordered 'Line of Pollity', so fingers crossed it can keep up the goodness!

TechnoHippy 30 Jun 2010 11:26:36 19,245 posts
Seen 2 weeks ago
Registered 18 years ago

Jetset_UK wrote:

spindizzy wrote:

Also, if anyone likes ultra violent, fast paced, far future space opera - anything by Neal Asher is going to make you very happy indeed. I think he's slightly running out of ideas now, but Spatterjay is a fantastic creation, and the Prador are wonderfully nasty.

Picked up 'Gridlinked' a week or so ago based on your recommendation, and really enjoyed it, have just ordered 'Line of Pollity', so fingers crossed it can keep up the goodness!

I'm quite a fan of the Polity books, reading Orbus at the moment, which is pretty good. Spider is an excellent drone :-)

glaeken 30 Jun 2010 11:36:19 12,070 posts
Seen 7 months ago
Registered 17 years ago

Ashers Polity books are great fun. I think he has run out of steam a little in the series recently but they are still good fun books. I kind of think of him as some sort of mash up of Richard Morgan and Peter F Hamilton as he has the ultra violence of the former but very much does the space opera type style books of the later.

Book recommendation (sci-fi) • Page 8