F1 2012 for 360, PS3, PC Page 4

  • AceGrace 21 Sep 2012 14:20:33 3,190 posts
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    So very pleased that I haven't bought this. Will wait and see if Codemasters fix the bugs.
  • monkman76 21 Sep 2012 14:25:25 12,555 posts
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    I'll probably still get it :D
  • AceGrace 21 Sep 2012 15:07:04 3,190 posts
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    Me too!

    (Eventually) :)
  • brseg 24 Sep 2012 21:07:32 679 posts
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    I grabbed f1 2012 (360) over the weekend, not played that much yet but generally happy with the upgrade over 2010. I was actually a bit put off by the demo - the steering seemed *really* twitchy on pad, but the full version seems fine. Huh, nice demo guys :p

    New physics, AI etc make it feel pretty fresh compared to 2010. Cars look good, framerate much better. But, how this upgrade looks to a 2011 player is another matter - you already had better handling + Kers & DRS in 2011.

    No online accnt at mo, but I hear they changed *nothing* about the online modes anyway, which is very disappointing. So much scope there, but they do nothing?
  • brseg 24 Sep 2012 21:23:57 679 posts
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    @Ilovechips well, it was mostly the demo (which I've now deleted). It was only from reading forums that I found out the final handling wasnt like that. I hope they dont patch it and make it worse :(

    I've got ABS off and TC on. I lock-up a bit, but I'd rather learn that. Maybe I should turn off TC, dunno. f1 2010 handling was a walk in the park, almost no accel/brake control needed.
  • SomaticSense 5 Oct 2012 13:30:57 15,110 posts
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    Impressed they fixed the unrealistically godlike AI grip and insane lap times that were present in 2010.

    Race day, Legendary difficulty. Final few laps of the race, me in a Force India running at a great 6th place behind Schumi and Alonso. Stupid HRT suddenly brakes in the middle of the final chicane instead of letting us three past cleanly.

    Alonso smacks into the back of him. Schumi smacks into the back of Alonso. All very predictable. I manage to avoid a serious accident and quickly jink right during the middle of the final curve getting past all three near stationary cars, however just clipping the left of my front wing on Schumacher's right rear tyre, which I couldn't do anything about as I would not have been able to brake in time. I can't quite believe my luck at running 4th place with just a few laps to go, I'm delirious with excitement.

    Drive through penalty for causing a collision. FOR ME! I check the Race Director. None for the HRT for a dangerous braking move, none for Alonso for ploughing into the back of him, and likewise none for Schumi. But I get one for slightly clipping my front wing, an accident which was so minor it had zero effect on anybody? What in holy fuck is that bullshit about Codies?

    Also, there was no safety car at all despite the fact there were front and rear wings splayed about in the middle of a chicane. And all of a sudden the lack of safety cars and penalties to AI drivers in the previous four races start to make sense, with the game now feeling broken and all the sense of immersion has now been destroyed.

    Complete fucking bollocks.

    Next race... Monaco. Can't wait! /rolls eyes

    Edited by SomaticSense at 13:36:10 05-10-2012
  • KnuttinAtoll 5 Oct 2012 13:44:30 5,513 posts
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    @SomaticSense - Monaco is actually now quite drivable. And I'm playing with a pad - dreaded it before but now it was quite as it should be; on the knife's edge but manageable. So far the AI is a lot more consistent, I'm currently at Hockenheim (playing on Professional level) and I (driving the Caterham) usually ended up close to my teammate around 18th place (+/- 3 positions).

    I got pretty annoyed with the game after 2-3 races (mainly for the same reasons as you mention, victims getting punished with penalties or low speed spins on wet surfaces, see below), after changing the settings to n00b (ABS on, Full traction, automatic gears, flags reduced, full damage) it's now rather enjoyable apart from two major gripes:

    1. The grip levels between dry/inter/wet tyres on wet/dry surfaces are ridiculous - the suggested tyre may be intermediate, drive with wets and you're sliding all over the place. WTF? Broken.

    Use Intermediates/Wets on dry surface, sliding all over the place as well. Why? What I would expect is increased tyre wear but this is just stupid. And broken.

    I wish I could switch off wet weather altogether until they fix the grip on different surface conditions, it's just no fun at all and laughably unrealistic, even though it does look nice.

    2. Framerate is subpar on the PS3 on most tracks, sometimes the game even freezes for 1-2 seconds (!). A racing game not running smoothly/below 30fps shouldn't be published until it does.

    Edited by SYS64738 at 13:58:12 05-10-2012
  • thelzdking 5 Oct 2012 14:23:09 7,459 posts
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    It sounds like Codemasters' quality control is shit, or they just don't give a fuck. Either way they can piss off.

    Edited by thelzdking at 14:23:24 05-10-2012
  • shamblemonkee 5 Oct 2012 14:34:44 17,897 posts
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    @brseg good ot see you back in the F1 fold o/.

    My take on 2012...
    Coming from playing F1 2011 every tuesday for a year the initial transistion to '12 was very rocky for me.

    The demo, which prior to release i thought would be an excellent marketing tool actually turned out to be a mssive mistake in my view, so unreprasentative of the final product was it. I was so put off by the heavy spring in the wheel and lack of feel that I pretty much decided there and then that i wouldn't be getting '12. Fairly huge when you consider i'd been playing F1 every tuesday for 100 odd weeks prior to that.

    When the full game arrived I heard that the handling was improved from the demo and sounded a bit more like what i had experiened at codemasters community day.

    Day 1
    So I picked it up a week or so ago. AI pace is much improved, subtle changes to lighting and track graphics mean it loks a bit nicer than last year. engine sounds a more visceral althoug they don't match the intensity or reality,

    As for handling - First impressions were that the wheel weight was improved but that the non-linearity in wheel rotation remained - a massive pain. Also initial turn in was very jolty making small adjustments on straights and gradual turns ins very hard. Leaving the game feeling twitchy, imprecise and frustrating

    Compounding that i was still attempting to drive in a manner similar to 2011 where the front wheels would grip almost forever and if they did give up grip you'd just back off slightly and bang, grip again.

    So after my first day with the game i was still not very impressed. I pretty much said to my league that i'd give it another couple of tries but that if it still didn't click it was getting traded.

    Roughly a week later i gave the game another go and i'm glad that i did. I began on pad driving with plenty to spare just getting used to new braking points, maximum slip angles and so on. Once back on to wheel i kept the same method and was able ot gradualy dial it back up.

    The biggest difference to how playable the game was on a wheel though was to (grudingly) alter the linearity - adjusting it to 13% removed the jerkiness on initial turn-in making it much more playable. so with that and finally finding the correct approach to driving in the '12 model (being able ot feel the angle of peak slip and NOt apply full lock all the time), I'm now feeling much much happier with the game - a mix of 10 and 11's feeling.

    silver Linings
    Every silver lining has its cloud and F1 2012 still has a few things that i wish could be fixed or changed.

    * FFB still very sparse and can be inconsistent

    * Linear steering - i want my 1:1 ratio back!

    * implementation of racing line: even in practice sessions

    * the cars can still feel very stiff when trying to break loose with an excessive feeling of centerspring

    * Penalties are still a joke - i appreciate it's a tough thing to code for but in 3 years it's not seen much improvement

    * AI passing - whether passing for position, lapping or being passed during practice the AI is too passive and indecisive.

    Online League
    If anyone is looking to race regularly online on XBOx we have a Eurogamer League that's been going since F1 2010 came out. We've got rich history and have been involved with races against codemasters themselves and recently a select few got to play the current game early at Codies Southam studio.

    We race 50% distance, no assists, dynamic weather, full sims (tyre, fuel, damage).

    Interest, drop me a PM, contact me on twitter (@shamblemonkee) or join the group here: http://www.eurogamer.net/forum/groups/2803
  • KnuttinAtoll 5 Oct 2012 14:52:13 5,513 posts
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    While I wouldn't consider the game a simulation (with the settings I'm playing at at least) I do enjoy it now EXCEPT for wet races with changing conditions. The change in grip is so abrupt that when say the track dries up and you're on wets, you're fine until a point where the grip is just completely gone, it's like ice-skating, even at low speeds.

    It also doesn't help that (at least for me) it's absolutely impossible to recover from a slide/spin (again I'm playing on a pad, might be easier with a wheel?). Once the grip is gone you just sit in the car and wait until it slides to a halt, usually against a wall, there's nothing you can do to catch the car again before that happens. It's actually laughable. You're then ending up nurturing the car back to the pits while the AI sails past you.

    On dry tracks it's pretty good and I had some proper decent races with the AI. But I had to set the flag rules to reduced as the game kept punishing me for crashes the AI caused. If you like me only play 25% this means race over.
  • brseg 6 Oct 2012 20:21:27 679 posts
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    Inside Sim Racing review vid is up:

    I'm still enjoying the game a lot (360+pad). I'm doing Pro AI, I hear legend is bonkers hard. The AI are still crap for the first 2-3 corners, but never mind. The car physics are a million times more interesting than 2010, you feel the track now.

    The season challenge is a nice alternative to full career - quick races and quick team progression. Even the champions mode is a nice diversion.

    Yeah, wet weather is really tough, and you *must* be on the correct tyre. I find that smooth input is the key, else you're going for a spin ;) Similarly, inters on a dry track are a nightmare.

    As shambles said, penalties are still kinda broken. It forces you to not do kamikaze overtakes, but some penalties are plain wrong. You have to either rewind, restart, or pretend it was like a real life crap FIA decision, and soldier on.
  • brseg 6 Oct 2012 21:51:39 679 posts
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    @Ilovechips - I'm finishing close to my team mate in most races on Pro. Its when you start winning in an HRT that you need to bump it up ;) People wanted Legend to be tougher -- they got it.

    I read about the penalty fixes in the upcoming patch, and some handling tweaks (dont know when xbox will get these). Sounds like the game could become even better. Still get the feeling we are the beta testers every year...

    Edited by brseg at 21:53:45 06-10-2012
  • superdelphinus 6 Oct 2012 22:13:18 9,781 posts
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    im losing track of all these patches, especially as steam's list of them doesn't seem to be up to date!

    legend ai does seem to be better than last year, but I thought the same last year as well but still ended up 1.5 to 2 seconds faster than them within a few months
  • shamblemonkee 6 Oct 2012 23:17:23 17,897 posts
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    I'm on legend au and it's actually at the correct Pace do far, not too slow into corners and overall lap times are challenging. Had to drive the nuts off the marussia to nab 18 th at Australia and Malaysia. One thin tho, expecting me to finish 17th in a marrusia?!??!

    Edited by shamblemonkee at 23:26:37 06-10-2012
  • KnuttinAtoll 7 Oct 2012 02:59:36 5,513 posts
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    The game seems a bit simple when it comes to team expectations, i.e the team always wants you to finish one place above your qualified start position at least. So if you fluked a top ten spot with the HRT, maybe due to changing weather, good luck!

    Ended up dropping the difficulty to Intermediate to make progression a bit easier. Finished around 12-15 with the Caterham, until I raced in Singapore. Almost nabbed the Pole, and lead the race until the second last lap until I spun. When I tried to reverse and go fwd to get back into the right direction, of course the next car behind went into my side, and guess who got a 10 sec penalty *sigh*.

    Am curious as to how the AI pace will be on Intermediate for the remainder of the season. Might have to bump it up to Pro again worst case, to be fair the pace was pretty realistic on that for me.

    Now if the framerate wouldn't be so ropey at times... I'm actually quite enjoying the game now otherwise.

    Edited by SYS64738 at 03:04:16 07-10-2012
  • SomaticSense 7 Oct 2012 16:17:37 15,110 posts
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    I've decided that for the first time in a racing game, I'll be using the cop-out flashback insta-rewind function. Up until now I've always avoided them for any game which has had them (F1, Dirt, Forza, etc) and have switched them off completely if I've had the option.

    However, the aforementioned penalty bullshit (5 races, 4 penalties for me, 3 of which were entirely unfair, 0 for AI throughout the entire 50% distance of each race) means I'm willing to cheat in order to even it out.

    AI cheats? I cheat. Fair game.

    It would've been nice if the AI actually got penalised as well, then I would be able to take the penalties which will inevitably come my way, but oh well. I guess it's just no penalties for anyone over the course of a season then! Charlie Whiting must love this game!
  • hypoBla5t 7 Oct 2012 16:33:07 2,250 posts
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    Is it worth trading 11 in for 12 guys?
  • Agent_Llama 7 Oct 2012 16:44:09 3,686 posts
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    hypoBla5t wrote:
    Is it worth trading 11 in for 12 guys?
    Not yet, no. I'm going back to finish my 2011 career whilst they fix the bugs on console.
  • superdelphinus 7 Oct 2012 16:54:26 9,781 posts
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    Pc is basically patched up to the state of the final version of '11 now in terms of bugs
  • SolidSCB 7 Oct 2012 17:10:04 10,176 posts
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    I can't believe some of the absolutely basic shit still hasn't been sorted. Are AI penalties and the odd mechanical failure really that hard to do? I seem to recall this sort of bog standard shit being available in games as early as F1 97 on the PS1 so there really is no excuse. The difficulty is still all over the place. Should I fuck be landing pole regularly in a Force India on the higher difficulties either. But then there are times the AI can take slow corners like they are Eau Rouge and completely eradicate a decent lead in seconds. I hear there is a safety car feature in the latest 2 games, but not once have I seen it come out on track in over a year of playing 2 seperate games, even when there is carnage on the track at the level of Belgium 1998.

    It is so close to being a really bloody good game, the driving is satisfying and the racing, at times is superb. But they get so many simple things that are fundamental to a dynamic and realistic F1 race wrong that it never feels like anything other than a cheap cash in and a very average game.
  • monkman76 9 Oct 2012 11:40:13 12,555 posts
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    superdelphinus wrote:
    Pc is basically patched up to the state of the final version of '11 now in terms of bugs
    Not sure what you mean by this? Was it more or less the same set of bugs in both games?

    Assume you mean playing 2011 and 2012 on PC you'll encounter a similar number of bugs / level of brokenness? In which case I might just plump for 2012.
  • SomaticSense 9 Oct 2012 13:09:38 15,110 posts
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    Complete carnage. Marussia front wings magnetically attracted the barriers at both the chicane and Antony Noghes. Debris strewn all over the place. A front wing in right the middle of the fast left hander leading into the Swimming Pool complex on the final lap of the race.

    No safety car. At all. Which makes me wonder if they've actually taken it out. If not, what exactly was the point in all the wasted coding time which could've been used to fix other areas of the game?

    Also, why is the AI capable of such insane wet race pace, when I am aquaplaning like a giraffe in ice?

    It has the potential of being an absolutely stunning game, but three incarnations later, and Codies still can't get the simple stuff right.

    Edited by SomaticSense at 13:11:05 09-10-2012
  • superdelphinus 9 Oct 2012 13:21:34 9,781 posts
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    @monkman76 the latter, though possibly slightly better than 11 now - I think there's just been a 6th pc patch
  • SomaticSense 7 Nov 2012 19:25:08 15,110 posts
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    Not played the game for a few days, but I got an update prompt today, meaning that a patch is now up.

    I've only had one race since it installed, but said race was a 100% wet race before after I did qually and was altered to 0% since the patch. Meaning that hopefully they've acknowledged and fixed the annoying frequency of wet races the game seemed to dole out in career more (all the way until Korea, I had just 2 dry races).

    Though saying that, the ingame emails say the next race is a wet one, so who knows...

    Edited by SomaticSense at 19:26:37 07-11-2012
  • hypoBla5t 19 Nov 2012 20:50:15 2,250 posts
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    Obviously I suck and that's the main reason that my qualifying times are shocking, but can anyone give me some tips on when to use DRS and KERS for best effect?

    At the moment I'm using DRS whenever I'm on a straight and the KERS for accelerating out of slow corners, is there more to it than that I'm missing out on or have I got the wrong end of the stick altogether?
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