Following Random Musings Page 1386

  • JamboWayOh 14 Oct 2019 13:16:09 15,740 posts
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    I had to explain what I meant to a couple of North American work colleagues when I said it was 'proper rammed' in the bar that we were in. But yeah, I hear a lot of dang. Not so much from the Spanish and Andorran friends, they swear with the best of them.

    Edited by JamboWayOh at 13:17:24 14-10-2019
  • racing_fan 14 Oct 2019 14:12:16 181 posts
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    I once read an article about Paul Dacre the editor of the Daily Mail. His journalists and staff say that when he calls you into into his office for a bollocking, he will swear frequently and strongly.

    But for extreme offenses, he will hand out what his staff call a "double cunting", which is where he will use the word "cunt" twice in the same sentence.

    I think that's really funny, and I think swearing is funny, but personally I rarely swear at work and only in front of other colleagues, never around management.
  • fontgeeksogood 14 Oct 2019 16:10:03 7,565 posts
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    This is the least bad thing I ever read about Dacre
  • Rogueywon Most Generous Forumite, 2016 14 Oct 2019 18:45:40 6,800 posts
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    One thing I picked up from a boss many years ago is that the angrier you get, the less you should swear. Now that I'm apparently "senior management" (which still scares me a bit), I do try to put this into practice.

    Blowing your top when you get bad news is never a good idea, as it means people will just conceal it in future. Plus shouting and swearing when stuff gets tough makes it look like you don't have a plan. But perhaps crucially, if you are normally a pretty sweary person, you can achieve even more effect by getting politer and politer. If you do need to give a bollocking, it can actually be more effective to let the bollockee fill in the "FUCKWITTED CUNFLAP"s in their mind.
  • beastmaster 14 Oct 2019 19:17:05 19,546 posts
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    Friend of mine just left her job without another one to go to. She’s in her late 30s and is hard of hearing. She’s recently started taking lip reading and sign language classes.

    She’s wanted to leave since January. She got told off by her bosses for “speaking too loudly” three times. HR at this place are an absolute bunch of utter fucktards, so they didn’t do much to help. I left the same place without a job to go to about a year and a half ago.
  • Mr_Sleep 14 Oct 2019 19:25:41 22,908 posts
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    It should always be noted that HR departments are not there for you. Their main focus is to protect the company.
  • anephric 14 Oct 2019 19:30:00 3,525 posts
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    There's more than one boss at mine that will give you a full 'You've cost me such and such, I'm going to rip you a new arsehole, I'll have your fucking job' etc. Or openly tell you to fuck off when you escalate an issue using the proper process.

    It's nice! Very rewarding place to work. Ain't no dolly mixtures in here.
  • Addy__ 14 Oct 2019 19:34:38 2,002 posts
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    Mr_Sleep wrote:
    It should always be noted that HR departments are not there for you. Their main focus is to protect the company.
    Indeed. HR at our place is all about 'exit management'
  • JamboWayOh 14 Oct 2019 19:39:33 15,740 posts
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    Mr_Sleep wrote:
    It should always be noted that HR departments are not there for you. Their main focus is to protect the company.
    Needs to be repeated again and again. You are a resource. They will do what they want with you for the benefit of the the company.
  • beastmaster 14 Oct 2019 19:39:59 19,546 posts
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    Addy__ wrote:
    Mr_Sleep wrote:
    It should always be noted that HR departments are not there for you. Their main focus is to protect the company.
    Indeed. HR at our place is all about 'exit management'
    Yep. Something that's easy to overlook or forget.
  • Rogueywon Most Generous Forumite, 2016 14 Oct 2019 19:43:42 6,800 posts
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    @anephric Yeah, see, that's a stupid way to work. All it means is that next time, people won't tell you when there's a problem. And if you don't know there's a problem on your patch, then you're the one who has the problem. I've known a few very senior people lose their jobs and one get a criminal record (major health and safety breach) because people had been too afraid to tell them stuff was going wrong.

    Besides, the person stood in front of you telling you about the massive fuckup is not, in my experience, usually the architect of that fuckup. The architect will be off somewhere else, trying to make sure blame is smeared around as evenly as possible. And if the person telling you about the fuckup did cause the fuckup, at least they're honest and probably want to help fix it.

    If a bollocking is needed (and occasionally it is), better to do it after the crisis has been dealt with, tempers have cooled and you are sure the bollocking is directed at the right target.
  • Frogofdoom 14 Oct 2019 19:45:11 14,620 posts
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    Place my mrs used to work at did the following. She was doing an interview alongside her department manager. At the end of the interview my mrs said that she didnt like the candidate and he replied you are jealous because she has a better rack than you. She went to HR to report it and was sacked a couple of weeks later after having a failing project dumped on her, they cited performance issues relating to the project. Good thing is the company is now having major money issues and is looking unlikely to survive much longer.
  • challenge_hanukkah 14 Oct 2019 19:48:08 11,621 posts
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    What a bunch of fucking cunts.

    She's well out of that pit of shittery.
  • Rogueywon Most Generous Forumite, 2016 14 Oct 2019 19:51:13 6,800 posts
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    Addy__ wrote:
    Mr_Sleep wrote:
    It should always be noted that HR departments are not there for you. Their main focus is to protect the company.
    Indeed. HR at our place is all about 'exit management'
    My worst experience of HR was about five years ago, when I was trying to fire somebody.

    Just to be clear, the individual in question was a genuinely contemptible piece of shit. As well as being useless at his job, he had a nasty, sadistic streak and enjoyed subtly bullying some of his colleagues (always targetting women, funnily enough). Some of his behaviour was verging on "creepy stalker" stuff. He was actually the most junior person in the team, but didn't let that stop him (not all bullying takes place downwards in the management chain).

    You'd think it'd be open and shut, but unfortunately there were two big obstacles. First, he was unionised (putting him in the minority at the place I worked, but some of the people who came in through the ops side did tend to be union) and was good mates with the local union rep (another nasty piece of work). Second, he had a (visible) disability. So HR basically took the stance "not touching him, he'll take us to tribunal and even if we win we don't want the publicity".

    So there was almost a year of back-and-forth between me (his boss's boss) and HR trying to get them to actually stand by their own disciplinary process. Finally, two things gave. First, one of his victims said (in writing) she was going to the police (and press) if we didn't do something. Second, his union rep quite literally dropped dead in the office one day and his replacement (a woman, for what it's worth) took one look at his case and decided she wasn't going to lift a finger to help him.

    The one and only sacking I've ever done. I've done some redundancy conversations before, which have left me feeling miserable for days afterwards. But that sacking felt good.

    But yeah, all HR were there to do was protect the company's very narrowly defined interest.
  • Addy__ 14 Oct 2019 19:51:41 2,002 posts
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    @Frogofdoom

    That's terrible. I know some at my place have had genuine complaints about their managers turned against them and they are the ones made to suffer. Saying that it does you know favours even being a manager in our place. Well our department anyway. I'm one of the longest serving employees now in IT because I seem to have kept below the radar and remained technical. I wouldn't take a management role even if it was offered. Work/Personal life balance ftw.
  • JamboWayOh 14 Oct 2019 19:52:37 15,740 posts
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    Frogofdoom wrote:
    Place my mrs used to work at did the following. She was doing an interview alongside her department manager. At the end of the interview my mrs said that she didnt like the candidate and he replied you are jealous because she has a better rack than you. She went to HR to report it and was sacked a couple of weeks later after having a failing project dumped on her, they cited performance issues relating to the project. Good thing is the company is now having major money issues and is looking unlikely to survive much longer.
    Wow. There's got a tribunal case for unfair dismissal no, that's fucked up.
  • Frogofdoom 14 Oct 2019 19:59:06 14,620 posts
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    She is best off away from there and it led to her working for an amazing company now. They are genuinely the best employer I have ever seen and look after their staff properly. We did speak to some employment lawyers at the time and they cited the time she was working there as an issue and that it would basically be a he/she said with a disgruntled ex employee causing a fuss, so we left it
  • challenge_hanukkah 14 Oct 2019 20:01:06 11,621 posts
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    @Rogueywon

    He sounds lovely
  • Rogueywon Most Generous Forumite, 2016 14 Oct 2019 20:03:22 6,800 posts
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    @challenge_hanukkah I think I've personally known three people over the years who I would move beyond the "cunt" category into the rather Biblical-sounding "evil". He was one of them.
  • JoeBlade 14 Oct 2019 20:06:38 4,532 posts
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    Wow, I'm not sure what sort of places you lot work at but my experiences with HR are quite different. They're there for the company, sure, but they are also invested in keeping employees happy to make sure they stay.

    Granted, I work in IT and me and my colleagues have profiles that were/are extremely sought after; filling positions/replacing someone isn't easy at all for most companies in this sector.
  • Addy__ 14 Oct 2019 20:12:40 2,002 posts
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    @Rogueywon

    That sounded awful. Especially that drawn out.
  • Rogueywon Most Generous Forumite, 2016 14 Oct 2019 20:13:36 6,800 posts
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    @JoeBlade HR can put up a good show of that kind of thing, but I've never found it more than skin deep.

    In my story above, the background was that my employer at the time put a great deal of weight on being seen as disability-friendly. They'd won awards for it and stuff. And that's good and to be encouraged.

    But HR were petrified that being taken to a tribunal by a disabled member of staff would cut against their objectives, even if said member of staff was a vile cunt making life misery for others.
  • challenge_hanukkah 14 Oct 2019 20:14:23 11,621 posts
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    I just don't get where people find the energy to be so consistently awful.

    Can you field this one ecosse?
  • Addy__ 14 Oct 2019 20:17:32 2,002 posts
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    challenge_hanukkah wrote:
    I just don't get where people find the energy to be so consistently awful.

    Can you field this one ecosse?
    Lol I'd ask him but I'm ignored now.
  • Rogueywon Most Generous Forumite, 2016 14 Oct 2019 20:17:48 6,800 posts
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    @challenge_hanukkah Some people seem to actively draw energy from making others miserable. To my mind, that's the dividing line between "thoughtless cunt" and "outright evil".
  • nickthegun 14 Oct 2019 20:18:12 79,230 posts
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    JoeBlade wrote:
    Wow, I'm not sure what sort of places you lot work at but my experiences with HR are quite different. They're there for the company, sure, but they are also invested in keeping employees happy to make sure they stay.

    Granted, I work in IT and me and my colleagues have profiles that were/are extremely sought after; filling positions/replacing someone isn't easy at all for most companies in this sector.
    Yeah, same. They take whistleblowing and HR grievances incredibly seriously. In fact, they take it so seriously that development and retention of staff is, as a people manager, part of my performance plan and I have to do occasional courses on 'fair outcomes' and unconscious bias.

    Edited by nickthegun at 20:18:37 14-10-2019
  • Rogueywon Most Generous Forumite, 2016 14 Oct 2019 20:25:08 6,800 posts
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    @nickthegun I'm sure that's true, but they are just doing it because it fits the organisation's agenda and the image it wants to project. Don't get me wrong, that's not necessarily a bad thing. But what they're doing there is both brand-management and tribunal-proofing (as well as retention).

    In my experience, HR is like project management. It's an important function and when done well, it can be really helpful. But unfortunately, both functions seem to attract the exact kind of person least cut out to do them well.
  • Dougs 14 Oct 2019 20:29:56 91,055 posts
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    My HR dept are fucking hopeless. The last round of redundancies were brutal but more than that, they're just not very good at their job. Queries go unanswered for weeks on end, when advice does arrive it's inconsistent and recruiting is a joke.
  • JamboWayOh 14 Oct 2019 20:32:33 15,740 posts
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    From my own experience, government and local government HR is and was absolutely bollocks.
  • Addy__ 14 Oct 2019 20:33:12 2,002 posts
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    Did someone mention brand management? Come in Kal, I repeat come in.
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