Following Audiophiles unite Page 26

  • phAge 15 Dec 2017 12:57:46 25,487 posts
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    Currently building two nearfield subwoofers for my cinema dungeon. 2 x 12" woofers in each enclosure, powered by a iNuke 6000 DSP. Interesting how it'll turn out.
  • UncleLou Moderator 15 Dec 2017 13:14:10 40,080 posts
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    Don't forget to plug in the audio cables.
  • Tomo 29 Dec 2017 11:02:12 16,433 posts
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    Anyone know about subwoofers?!

    I'm interested in getting one for my pretty small living room. Richer Sounds has the Cambridge Aero 9 for £249. 500W sub compared to 200W or less ones at the same price, so it seems like a chunky discount. But, I don't really know anything about them and reading up on them isn't getting me very far!
  • THFourteen 29 Dec 2017 11:37:40 51,132 posts
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    @Tomo do you live in a house or a flat?

    Kills anyone who lives below you...
  • Mr_Sleep 29 Dec 2017 11:56:15 22,154 posts
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    The primary reason to have a subwoofer in a system is that they isolate bass below a certain frequency which makes for a cleaner sound from your other speakers which aren't able to perform so well at the lowere end. If you are not that bothered by sub bass and making a cleaner sound elsewhere in your setup then there probably isn't much point.
  • Tomo 29 Dec 2017 13:58:10 16,433 posts
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    I'm in a flat, albeit ground floor. We have people on the other side of the living room wall though... I did wonder about that... lol

    Yeah, I'm aware of their function, just not so much price ranges/specs etc. Seems like even more of a minefield than amps/speakers.
  • gamingdave 3 Jan 2018 14:59:37 4,782 posts
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    If I was buying a sub, I would simply look no further than https://www.bkelec.com/HiFi/Sub_Woofers.htm
  • THFourteen 18 Jan 2018 16:15:54 51,132 posts
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    https://www.theverge.com/2018/1/18/16903516/headphones-wireless-analog-jack-future-ces-2018

    As a supporter of wireless sound for a very long time, its interesting to see that what some people predicted in Apple removing the headphone jack is forcibly pushing wireless technology forwards now, where it was previously stagnating.

    I should add that the fragmentation is fucking irritating. Fortunately the MDR-1000Xs i use support aptX and AAC so i get reasoanbly good quality with iOS devices and apt-x dongles i use for my switch or PC.

    But they dont support things like the W1 fast pair and things like that.

    Edited by THFourteen at 16:30:33 18-01-2018
  • cjb_bjc 18 Feb 2018 22:53:48 2,039 posts
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    I really need some help with my music setup. I've got sets of speakers wired into the cielings of our lounge, kitchen and bedrooms. The wires all converge in the kitchen cupboard. What's the best amp to be able to play different sources in different rooms? I know I can chain Sonos connect amps, but this would get rather pricey... Any other suggestions?
  • Armoured_Bear 18 Feb 2018 23:15:13 25,805 posts
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    Tomo wrote:
    Anyone know about subwoofers?!

    I'm interested in getting one for my pretty small living room. Richer Sounds has the Cambridge Aero 9 for £249. 500W sub compared to 200W or less ones at the same price, so it seems like a chunky discount. But, I don't really know anything about them and reading up on them isn't getting me very far!
    If you can go a bit higher, bkelec are great.
  • Carlo 20 Feb 2018 21:32:37 20,489 posts
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    I've had to send back my B&W PX headphones (the volume down button stopped clicking)

    So bit miffed about build quality from a brand that was supposed to have incredible attention to detail, but impressed that the return was quibble free, and the replacement is brand new, not some reconditioned unit.
  • cjb_bjc 20 Feb 2018 23:35:04 2,039 posts
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    Anyone help me with the above?
  • CrispyXUKTurbo 20 Feb 2018 23:43:01 1,726 posts
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    Armoured_Bear wrote:
    Tomo wrote:
    Anyone know about subwoofers?!

    I'm interested in getting one for my pretty small living room. Richer Sounds has the Cambridge Aero 9 for £249. 500W sub compared to 200W or less ones at the same price, so it seems like a chunky discount. But, I don't really know anything about them and reading up on them isn't getting me very far!
    If you can go a bit higher, bkelec are great.
    Can't go wrong with either. Ignore the wattage, the BK are great.
  • CrispyXUKTurbo 20 Feb 2018 23:46:01 1,726 posts
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    cjb_bjc wrote:
    Anyone help me with the above?
    T-amps, ebay
  • Armoured_Bear 11 Apr 2018 11:16:29 25,805 posts
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    So I just bought myself a Linn Akurate DS Streamer, finally replacing the battleship CD Player I sold a while ago.
    Iím seriously impressed, easy to setup and sounds fantastic.
    The head to head with my turntable will be interestingÖ.



    I haven't tried any hi-res downloads yet.
    Any EGers with experience?

    Edited by Armoured_Bear at 11:17:35 11-04-2018
  • gamingdave 11 Apr 2018 17:49:32 4,782 posts
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    Armoured_Bear wrote:
    I haven't tried any hi-res downloads yet.
    Any EGers with experience?
    Blimey that's a very expensive way of going digital. I imagine it sounds stunning, but wondering how much better than any other streamer with a high end DAC.

    As for hi-res downloads. I tried a few and did a lot of ABX testing on myself and some friends (including a couple of musicians). Tried both speaker and headphone setups, and several DACs including an M-Audio pro interface and a Fiio X7II.

    The results were that people could nearly always hear the difference between MP3 and 44.1/16, but going above that people stopped being able to differentiate.

    Saying that, often the masters are a lot better than those on CD (or streaming services) so whilst the hi-res part is pointless, the dynamic range is often higher (which is still true when you downsample to 44.1/16).

    So if you have a favourite album, give it a try. Considering the cost of your streamer, it would seem churlish not to sample a couple.
  • Armoured_Bear 11 Apr 2018 19:48:29 25,805 posts
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    gamingdave wrote:
    Armoured_Bear wrote:
    I haven't tried any hi-res downloads yet.
    Any EGers with experience?
    Blimey that's a very expensive way of going digital. I imagine it sounds stunning, but wondering how much better than any other streamer with a high end DAC.

    As for hi-res downloads. I tried a few and did a lot of ABX testing on myself and some friends (including a couple of musicians). Tried both speaker and headphone setups, and several DACs including an M-Audio pro interface and a Fiio X7II.

    The results were that people could nearly always hear the difference between MP3 and 44.1/16, but going above that people stopped being able to differentiate.

    Saying that, often the masters are a lot better than those on CD (or streaming services) so whilst the hi-res part is pointless, the dynamic range is often higher (which is still true when you downsample to 44.1/16).

    So if you have a favourite album, give it a try. Considering the cost of your streamer, it would seem churlish not to sample a couple.
    I bought it second hand, got a bargain so it "only" cost me 1300 quid, I've no idea how it compares but compared to streaming to my Pioneer SC-LX70 AV Amp there's a huge difference.

    I'll definitely give a few albums a go, I found often with vinyl that some records sounded so much better as they hadn't been mastered for tards, hoping as you suggest, there will be the same benefits for high-res downloads.

    I've heard similar anecdotes to yours from a few people.
    I'm just delighted for the moment to be able to listen to albums that I don't have on vinyl in great quality again.
  • gamingdave 13 Apr 2018 13:32:07 4,782 posts
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    That is a bargain (relatively speaking).

    You've hit the nail on the head. All in the mastering, and often why a vinyl release can sound better than the CD, it's simply not maxed out.

    Good start would be to look here for those albums with better dynamic range from HD releases - http://dr.loudness-war.info/

    Or you could enter the warren that is the Steve Hoffman forums: http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/
  • Armoured_Bear 13 Apr 2018 13:36:49 25,805 posts
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    gamingdave wrote:
    That is a bargain (relatively speaking).

    You've hit the nail on the head. All in the mastering, and often why a vinyl release can sound better than the CD, it's simply not maxed out.

    Good start would be to look here for those albums with better dynamic range from HD releases - http://dr.loudness-war.info/

    Or you could enter the warren that is the Steve Hoffman forums: http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/
    Cheers for the links, Iím already familiar with the SteveHoffman forum, itís quite a special place :)
  • UncleLou Moderator 13 Apr 2018 13:47:29 40,080 posts
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    Armoured_Bear wrote:

    I bought it second hand, got a bargain so it "only" cost me 1300 quid, I've no idea how it compares but compared to streaming to my Pioneer SC-LX70 AV Amp there's a huge difference.
    No offence, but I really doubt there is a "huge difference" - where is it supposed to come from? The DAC? The differences between DACs that aren't complete crap are minimal.

    The amp? Amps are simple technology. If a company - like Naim - uses the term "Naim sound" for their amplifiers, run in the other direction as fast as you can. :p

    A mixture of psychological effects and non-leveled volume seems more likely than a real difference. If one device is just a tiny bit louder than another one with otherwise unchanged settings, you'll think it sounds "better", and there's bugger all you can do about it other than use a sound-level meter and compare then.

    Edited by UncleLou at 13:51:44 13-04-2018
  • gamingdave 13 Apr 2018 16:26:27 4,782 posts
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    UncleLou wrote:
    No offence, but I really doubt there is a "huge difference" - where is it supposed to come from? The DAC? The differences between DACs that aren't complete crap are minimal.
    I'm always sceptical of high end hi-fi too. But I can hear the difference between my Fiio X7ii and Oppo HA2 when driving headphones. It's certainly not night and day, but it is there.

    Back in the days of CD I used a DVD player. My first was a Pioneer 717 which for the early years was regarded as the best player on the market (should hope so, it was £550 in 1999). It was later replaced by a cheaper Pioneer but with much better video processing. The sound though, the 717 still knocked spots of it.

    There is definitely a lot of psychological effects, but I always say if you can afford it, and it brings you pleasure, then go for it.

    Armoured_Bear wrote:
    Cheers for the links, Iím already familiar with the SteveHoffman forum, itís quite a special place :)
    Special indeed :D

    But it can be very handy at times for checking if a re-release is up to scratch.
  • Armoured_Bear 13 Apr 2018 21:17:30 25,805 posts
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    UncleLou wrote:
    Armoured_Bear wrote:

    I bought it second hand, got a bargain so it "only" cost me 1300 quid, I've no idea how it compares but compared to streaming to my Pioneer SC-LX70 AV Amp there's a huge difference.
    No offence, but I really doubt there is a "huge difference" - where is it supposed to come from? The DAC? The differences between DACs that aren't complete crap are minimal.

    The amp? Amps are simple technology. If a company - like Naim - uses the term "Naim sound" for their amplifiers, run in the other direction as fast as you can. :p

    A mixture of psychological effects and non-leveled volume seems more likely than a real difference. If one device is just a tiny bit louder than another one with otherwise unchanged settings, you'll think it sounds "better", and there's bugger all you can do about it other than use a sound-level meter and compare then.
    No offence taken but well, there is a huge difference, It's not my first hi-fi component, I'm aware of the difference in perception with volume differences.After your post I again matched the sound levels and also made the AV Stream louder and the difference is not subtle. In comparison, the AV Amp Stream sounds muffled, closed and dull. As a quick test, my gf came home from work (she is in no way an audio geek) , I switched between them with her standing in the room, not a listening position and asked her "Do they sound different?" - "Of course". "Which one is better?" "That one" (The Linn).

    You say the differences between DACs are minimal, I have no idea personally.
    Have you did a comparison of many DACS side by side?

    There is lots of nonsense in expensive hi-fi, especially with stupidly priced cables but IMO the whole "all amps that aren't clipping sound the same" truth belief is nonsense.
  • Deleted user 13 April 2018 22:39:01
    HDvinyl.org
  • UncleLou Moderator 13 Apr 2018 23:01:34 40,080 posts
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    Armoured_Bear wrote:

    There is lots of nonsense in expensive hi-fi, especially with stupidly priced cables but IMO the whole "all amps that aren't clipping sound the same" truth belief is nonsense.
    There's a difference between tube amps and solid state, obviously. And vinyl sounds differently as well, of course. But differently sounding solid state amplifiers are deep, deep in snakeoil territory imo. I've yet to hear about a single double blind test where people can hear a difference between a 20,000 quid Macintosh amp and a 200 quid Pioneer. They can't.

    As a quick test, my gf came home from work (she is in no way an audio geek) , I switched between them with her standing in the room, not a listening position and asked her "Do they sound different?" - "Of course". "Which one is better?" "That one" (The Linn).

    If it is *that* obvious, you must have something in one of the two audio chains with a completely absurd frequency repsonse, imo.

    Edited by UncleLou at 23:10:37 13-04-2018
  • mrharvest 14 Apr 2018 02:47:44 5,586 posts
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    UncleLou wrote:
    Armoured_Bear wrote:
    As a quick test, my gf came home from work (she is in no way an audio geek) , I switched between them with her standing in the room, not a listening position and asked her "Do they sound different?" - "Of course". "Which one is better?" "That one" (The Linn).

    If it is *that* obvious, you must have something in one of the two audio chains with a completely absurd frequency repsonse, imo.
    Maybe observational bias?

    I don't know. This is something I struggle with. I have worked as a sound engineer 6 years. In the industry people are generally speaking level headed, no one buys £500 cables - one mic cable sounds the same as another and generally speaking you can only spend money on reliability.

    But everyone swears ADCs in recorders sound different. How different, that's up to debate and the main selling point of a £5000 recorder over a £500 recorder isn't the digital conversion. It's features, reliability and pre-amps, and the client will never be able to tell which ADCs you had in the signal chain.

    But still, take 10 location mixers and I bet 9 will say that Sonosax ADC is different to Sound Devices is different to Zoom. Same with DACs, although to lesser extent (unless you ask mastering engineers).

    It's a tough one. I know objectively there shouldn't be much difference. But I have my experience of gear in actual situations and my same mic with same pre-amp in two different recorders seems to sound different. So, dunno man?

    That said, in a (home) listening environment the best bang for buck improvements you can do to the sound are, in my opinion, in this order:
    - proper placement of speakers and listening position
    - speakers
    - acoustic treatment
    - signal media (and I mean good vinyl vs. cheap vinyl, uncompressed vs. lossy compression)
    - and after those it's amplifiers and DACs and other stuff
  • Deleted user 14 April 2018 05:51:38
    spend all your money on speakers

    it's that simple
  • greg_wha 14 Apr 2018 06:32:12 1,257 posts
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    mrharvest wrote:
    - proper placement of speakers and listening position
    - speakers
    - acoustic treatment
    - signal media (and I mean good vinyl vs. cheap vinyl, uncompressed vs. lossy compression)
    - and after those it's amplifiers and DACs and other stuff
    This guy knows.
  • Armoured_Bear 14 Apr 2018 07:44:06 25,805 posts
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    Iíd love to know what the observational bias from
    my girlfriend was when she had no idea which was which and doesnít give a shot about hiifi.

    Iíd also love to know what could have an ďabsurd frequency response ď in my system?
  • Lukus 14 Apr 2018 08:44:10 21,738 posts
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    Armoured_Bear wrote:
    Iíd love to know what the observational bias from
    my girlfriend was when she had no idea which was which and doesnít give a shot about hiifi.

    And you trust her opinion? She probably just picked the one she thought you wanted her to say to keep you happy
  • Lukus 14 Apr 2018 08:44:25 21,738 posts
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    Filthy audiophile
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