|
Edit: Will re-edit accordingly as I can't be bothered to do that now. Societies deserve to have what they have - you deserve the police you have, you deserve the government you have, you deserve the politicians you have. Same thing with games. Let us now have a closer look at the F2P market since it is the dominant force right now. The F2P supporters have always claimed that most people that play F2P are unemployed or low on income. That has been their thesis since the first day to draw more crowd away from the subscription model. "10-15 dollars a month is too much and most people given these circumstances cannot afford it", "You don't have to pay 10-15 dollars per month anymore to access the full game", "Forget subscription. It is dead" were positions widely accepted and commonly shared. Considering how attractive and profitable the F2P model has become, if their positions were true or bared any truth that mean that since most are not unable to pay a sub on that amount then that meant most would not be able to pay any money on a F2P MMO. If we follow now the chain on this logic and translate it to numbers and thus percentages, it would mean that a 10% percent of the market, the "whale culture" as the industry calls them, would be enough to fund each F2P MMO. However that whale culture would have to spend enough to cover monthly costs (all employees wages and payrolls, maintenance, technicians, customer support assistant, developers, servers, ect) which is not true. And it is not true because we do already know that every 1 out of 2 players gives a X amount of dollars per month and interesting enough (who would have thought eh?) that same player will definitely spend more money on a F2P game yearly than he would have spend on a subscription MMO. It is also a given fact that mainly in Europe and NA, F2P MMOrpgs have got extremely low population. "Dead servers", "Ghost towns", "Full of hackers, bots and goldsellers" is indeed not only a very common perception but it has started to become an expectation of the free-to-play industry. Regardless of that and taken into account the revenues of the F2P sphere of influence, it is a logical fallacy to believe that a few "whales" in all F2P MMOrpgs are not only millionaires and billionaires but the primarily force for covering every single's F2P MMOrpg daily, monthly and yearly costs and hence the multi-million/billion empire. As far as the demographics of this F2P playerbase, the information is simple and clear; the majority is not unemployed or on low income; the majority or alternatively "casuals" are usually family-oriented or workaholic individuals who do not have enough time to invest on a hardcore content driver MMO, and prefer to spend a few hours here and there on a standard F2P game. In addition, I personally do not know millions or billions of unemployed or low-on-income players who can afford to maintain a medium-gaming ring including hidden costs (electricity, ect) but not afford a 10-15 payment per month on a sub-MMO. So who the hell is this apparent vocal minority of not being able to afford a monthly sub? They are freeriders and freeloaders, the jumping-wagon crowd that jumps from one MMO to another MMO within the first month hence the massive exodus that is apparent these days; they are the so called "jumpers". As it stands, this vocal minority is nothing more than a plague of constant leeches who expect others to sacrifice their own income so they can play anything for free without ever giving a dime back. Until they leave and go to the next F2P game and repeat. More than usual you find this very verbal and vocal minority when a large amount legitimate paying customers or MMO veterans complain about the design of an apparently "Free to play" model which is 9 out of 10 not free, and more specifically freemium or Pay to win in hardcore gamers term. What is an irony though, is that these non-paying gamers always make an effort to stigmatize the paying gamers are "gamers that do not want to pay anything and expect everything for free and expect Developers to work for free". Next time you meet them ask them this question - "Why don't you start paying that much for once and support your beloved Developer that works extremely hard as well as its staff?" Since their position is that games are not free, then they should start putting money where their mouth is and in fact be the first ones to do so. F2P culture apart from the evidently ridiculous community of rude kids, full-mouth brats and teenagers, it has got also negative side effects to the MMO scene as a whole. And here I explain it clearly, Calling ALL Developers - Your games are Sub-parShort version - If you do not support models of business that respect customers and give you full access of the game, you know FULL game, instead of hiding it behind paypals and paywalls; unlike great business models such as the one in League of Legends and Guild Wars 2 or any other MMO where cash shop only sells cosmetics, stop bitching and moaning about the state of MMOs because you are the exact reason about that state. No one else apart from you is responsible for this sub-par quantity and quality. |
The hypocrisy of this MMO community.
-
0Authority 8 posts
Seen 7 years ago
Registered 7 years ago -
neilka 24,021 posts
Seen 4 hours ago
Registered 16 years ago0Authority wrote:
Not reading that
Edit: Will re-edit accordingly as I can't be bothered to do that now.
Societies deserve to have what they have - you deserve the police you have, you deserve the government you have, you deserve the politicians you have. Same thing with games.
Let us now have a closer look at the F2P market since it is the dominant force right now. The F2P supporters have always claimed that most people that play F2P are unemployed or low on income. That has been their thesis since the first day to draw more crowd away from the subscription model. "10-15 dollars a month is too much and most people given these circumstances cannot afford it", "You don't have to pay 10-15 dollars per month anymore to access the full game", "Forget subscription. It is dead" were positions widely accepted and commonly shared.
Considering how attractive and profitable the F2P model has become, if their positions were true or bared any truth that mean that since most are not unable to pay a sub on that amount then that meant most would not be able to pay any money on a F2P MMO. If we follow now the chain on this logic and translate it to numbers and thus percentages, it would mean that a 10% percent of the market, the "whale culture" as the industry calls them, would be enough to fund each F2P MMO.
However that whale culture would have to spend enough to cover monthly costs (all employees wages and payrolls, maintenance, technicians, customer support assistant, developers, servers, ect) which is not true. And it is not true because we do already know that every 1 out of 2 players gives a X amount of dollars per month and interesting enough (who would have thought eh?) that same player will definitely spend more money on a F2P game yearly than he would have spend on a subscription MMO.
It is also a given fact that mainly in Europe and NA, F2P MMOrpgs have got extremely low population. "Dead servers", "Ghost towns", "Full of hackers, bots and goldsellers" is indeed not only a very common perception but it has started to become an expectation of the free-to-play industry. Regardless of that and taken into account the revenues of the F2P sphere of influence, it is a logical fallacy to believe that a few "whales" in all F2P MMOrpgs are not only millionaires and billionaires but the primarily force for covering every single's F2P MMOrpg daily, monthly and yearly costs and hence the multi-million/billion empire.
As far as the demographics of this F2P playerbase, the information is simple and clear; the majority is not unemployed or on low income; the majority or alternatively "casuals" are usually family-oriented or workaholic individuals who do not have enough time to invest on a hardcore content driver MMO, and prefer to spend a few hours here and there on a standard F2P game.
In addition, I personally do not know millions or billions of unemployed or low-on-income players who can afford to maintain a medium-gaming ring including hidden costs (electricity, ect) but not afford a 10-15 payment per month on a sub-MMO.
So who the hell is this apparent vocal minority of not being able to afford a monthly sub?
They are freeriders and freeloaders, the jumping-wagon crowd that jumps from one MMO to another MMO within the first month hence the massive exodus that is apparent these days; they are the so called "jumpers". As it stands, this vocal minority is nothing more than a plague of constant leeches who expect others to sacrifice their own income so they can play anything for free without ever giving a dime back. Until they leave and go to the next F2P game and repeat.
More than usual you find this very verbal and vocal minority when a large amount legitimate paying customers or MMO veterans complain about the design of an apparently "Free to play" model which is 9 out of 10 not free, and more specifically freemium or Pay to win in hardcore gamers term. What is an irony though, is that these non-paying gamers always make an effort to stigmatize the paying gamers are
"gamers that do not want to pay anything and expect everything for free and expect Developers to work for free".
Next time you meet them ask them this question - "Why don't you start paying that much for once and support your beloved Developer that works extremely hard as well as its staff?" Since their position is that games are not free, then they should start putting money where their mouth is and in fact be the first ones to do so.
F2P culture apart from the evidently ridiculous community of rude kids, full-mouth brats and teenagers, it has got also negative side effects to the MMO scene as a whole. And here I explain it clearly,
Calling ALL Developers - Your games are Sub-par
Short version - If you do not support models of business that respect customers and give you full access of the game, you know FULL game, instead of hiding it behind paypals and paywalls; unlike great business models such as the one in League of Legends and Guild Wars 2 or any other MMO where cash shop only sells cosmetics, stop bitching and moaning about the state of MMOs because you are the exact reason about that state.
I have been playing MMOrpgs for 17 years now. I have invested in many time, effort, money, endless grind, top PVP or PVE player, hardcore or casual, Subscription/F2P/Freemium/B2P and you name it. I am a complete veteran of this genre.
This year and the previous one has been the worst year for this genre. Definitely the worse because instead of having MMOs trying to compete with the big players on the market such as World of Warcraft, Final Fantasy: A realm reborn, WildStar, Destiny, Blade & Soul, Phantasy Star Online 2 and Star Citizen and Kingdom Under Fire II we have games trying to compete with who is the more niche and how fast they can gain revenue by exploiting that niche market.
Let us have a look - Age of Wushu, Archlord 2, C9, Dragon Nest , Guild Wars 2, Firefall, Lord of the Rings, NeverWinter, Rift, Star Wars: The old republic, Swordsman Online, Tera Rising, The Secret World, Warframe and the list never drops. In fact, there are tons of F2P MMOrpgs and the problem is not that F2P exists as a business model, an alternative one to a subscription but the culture itself.
Cheap or Free does not guarantee quality. Anything good needs cash or some type of a strong long run investment. Period.
We all knew what would happen when Free 2 Play came around and mostly MMOers from the new age, were so passionate about the idea of FREE as if it meant FREEDOM and the whole mainstream press was embracing something in the same lines. What is ironical though is that the same press and new MMoers alike are steadily reaching the same conclusion - they are all reaching the same wall that old MMOers reached when the MMO market was stuck in the World of Warcraft era.
"We are bored. We need more. We want more".
And the consequences?
Reverse engineering - Instead of progressing forward to a more complete and unified MMOrpg genre it has dissected that genre into snacks and bites with incomplete PVE & PVP and hidden content through paywalls and paypals. Every single Free 2 Play MMOrpg right now is incomplete and lacks usually basic tools such as a good group finder. Progression has been backwards and that is exactly why we have got so many with disgusting graphics, generic character customization, unpolished combat and animations and bad level designs and environments. In all fronts, from story to gameplay, the F2P market will make sure that there is always going to be a core expectation missing in order to build up hype for the next generation of gamers.
Short life span - In every crisis or stale period, there are opportunities that whoever is the fastest and the smarter hits gold. Some MMOrpgs are good at doing that - filling up a hole through that particular period of stagnation; by taking advantage of the thirst of a niche MMO crowd such as the Lineage crowd with ArcheAge. Companies right now will not allow for complete MMOs to appear because there is no need to because the market is not at a good state nor competitive and there are way too many gaps.
Pipe dream – Option is good but it is not always good; when the minority dominates the majority that is unhealthy by default. Once one good subscription MMOrpg fulfils the gap in the market, the rest will get wiped, studios will close downs, jobs will be lost and so on and so forth. And there are two huge gaps - making a more refined MMOrpg of the past and making a more refined MMOrpg of that specific theme. If right now someone released the closest thing to a Skyrim multiplayer, ESO Online would go bankrupt.
Hideous purpose – F2P is all about money. Not just about money or some money. And the evidence comes from the very nature of the model ; you are just a free to play player from them; someone that plays their game for free; they do not have to listen to you, take your constructive criticism seriously; you have no authority or influence whatsoever; you are not entitled to anything. Pay2Win elements are often and if you dare to raise a voice you should not because you are not entitled to since you don’t pay money to the game. Hence you should be thankful to the “whales” to spend allot of money so you can play still play that game and still play it for free. And most importantly, regardless of how much money they make, they will never rival with the quality of a sub-based MMOrpg and it is pretty self-explanatory on why that is happening.
No expectations – That is right. Since you do not pay for anything you cannot expect anything. Standards can be as low as possible, the game can be as average as possible, customer service can be as non-existent as possible, floods of bots, goldsellers, spammers and hackers can be as big as possible, technical mess with high lag and spikes can be as often as possible and servers can be as ghost towns as possible. As long as the “whales” spend more money, have a reason to, everything else is irrelevant.
Forceful Adaptation – When you have no options because there is a lack of competition, you are forced to adapt. If you think Star Wars is the worst Star Wars, you will still play it because there is no other Star Wars to play. That creates a culture of taking breaks and painfully playing an MMO for the sake of being an MMO or due to boredom.
This has been one of the most ludicrous (for the business), subpar (for the genre) and ridiculous state of gaming where manipulative products of P2W dominate. This is like Steam flooded with indie games to justify that PC gaming is doing good and it still has the most exclusive titles when in reality most of them are byproducts of easy, cheap and intentionally lazy development. And in that respect, MMOs have become moneycash grabbing scheme like a bad Kickstarter project.
They will never attract millions of players because they don't deserve to attract millions of players. They are not that good and they do not want to be that good either. The intention of F2P MMOrpgs is not to make a great and complete MMOrpg experience but to cater to a niche and identify the whales which in turns become a money-grabbing marathon. That is why there is no loyalty from the playerbase. That is why they are not sub-based because they can never have many subs. There not again not that good and they can flood the market just like that.
We need competition because competition drives quality.
That is my argument and right now quality is secondary. Without competition, there are no standards, everything goes, there are no expectations. The culture behind F2P is a backward step.
No one else apart from you is responsible for this sub-par quantity and quality. -
BinaryBob101 27,755 posts
Seen 7 days ago
Registered 12 years ago0Authority wrote:
Fucking dull.
Edit: Will re-edit accordingly as I can't be bothered to do that now.
Societies deserve to have what they have - you deserve the police you have, you deserve the government you have, you deserve the politicians you have. Same thing with games.
Let us now have a closer look at the F2P market since it is the dominant force right now. The F2P supporters have always claimed that most people that play F2P are unemployed or low on income. That has been their thesis since the first day to draw more crowd away from the subscription model. "10-15 dollars a month is too much and most people given these circumstances cannot afford it", "You don't have to pay 10-15 dollars per month anymore to access the full game", "Forget subscription. It is dead" were positions widely accepted and commonly shared.
Considering how attractive and profitable the F2P model has become, if their positions were true or bared any truth that mean that since most are not unable to pay a sub on that amount then that meant most would not be able to pay any money on a F2P MMO. If we follow now the chain on this logic and translate it to numbers and thus percentages, it would mean that a 10% percent of the market, the "whale culture" as the industry calls them, would be enough to fund each F2P MMO.
However that whale culture would have to spend enough to cover monthly costs (all employees wages and payrolls, maintenance, technicians, customer support assistant, developers, servers, ect) which is not true. And it is not true because we do already know that every 1 out of 2 players gives a X amount of dollars per month and interesting enough (who would have thought eh?) that same player will definitely spend more money on a F2P game yearly than he would have spend on a subscription MMO.
It is also a given fact that mainly in Europe and NA, F2P MMOrpgs have got extremely low population. "Dead servers", "Ghost towns", "Full of hackers, bots and goldsellers" is indeed not only a very common perception but it has started to become an expectation of the free-to-play industry. Regardless of that and taken into account the revenues of the F2P sphere of influence, it is a logical fallacy to believe that a few "whales" in all F2P MMOrpgs are not only millionaires and billionaires but the primarily force for covering every single's F2P MMOrpg daily, monthly and yearly costs and hence the multi-million/billion empire.
As far as the demographics of this F2P playerbase, the information is simple and clear; the majority is not unemployed or on low income; the majority or alternatively "casuals" are usually family-oriented or workaholic individuals who do not have enough time to invest on a hardcore content driver MMO, and prefer to spend a few hours here and there on a standard F2P game.
In addition, I personally do not know millions or billions of unemployed or low-on-income players who can afford to maintain a medium-gaming ring including hidden costs (electricity, ect) but not afford a 10-15 payment per month on a sub-MMO.
So who the hell is this apparent vocal minority of not being able to afford a monthly sub?
They are freeriders and freeloaders, the jumping-wagon crowd that jumps from one MMO to another MMO within the first month hence the massive exodus that is apparent these days; they are the so called "jumpers". As it stands, this vocal minority is nothing more than a plague of constant leeches who expect others to sacrifice their own income so they can play anything for free without ever giving a dime back. Until they leave and go to the next F2P game and repeat.
More than usual you find this very verbal and vocal minority when a large amount legitimate paying customers or MMO veterans complain about the design of an apparently "Free to play" model which is 9 out of 10 not free, and more specifically freemium or Pay to win in hardcore gamers term. What is an irony though, is that these non-paying gamers always make an effort to stigmatize the paying gamers are
"gamers that do not want to pay anything and expect everything for free and expect Developers to work for free".
Next time you meet them ask them this question - "Why don't you start paying that much for once and support your beloved Developer that works extremely hard as well as its staff?" Since their position is that games are not free, then they should start putting money where their mouth is and in fact be the first ones to do so.
F2P culture apart from the evidently ridiculous community of rude kids, full-mouth brats and teenagers, it has got also negative side effects to the MMO scene as a whole. And here I explain it clearly,
Calling ALL Developers - Your games are Sub-par
Short version - If you do not support models of business that respect customers and give you full access of the game, you know FULL game, instead of hiding it behind paypals and paywalls; unlike great business models such as the one in League of Legends and Guild Wars 2 or any other MMO where cash shop only sells cosmetics, stop bitching and moaning about the state of MMOs because you are the exact reason about that state.
I have been playing MMOrpgs for 17 years now. I have invested in many time, effort, money, endless grind, top PVP or PVE player, hardcore or casual, Subscription/F2P/Freemium/B2P and you name it. I am a complete veteran of this genre.
This year and the previous one has been the worst year for this genre. Definitely the worse because instead of having MMOs trying to compete with the big players on the market such as World of Warcraft, Final Fantasy: A realm reborn, WildStar, Destiny, Blade & Soul, Phantasy Star Online 2 and Star Citizen and Kingdom Under Fire II we have games trying to compete with who is the more niche and how fast they can gain revenue by exploiting that niche market.
Let us have a look - Age of Wushu, Archlord 2, C9, Dragon Nest , Guild Wars 2, Firefall, Lord of the Rings, NeverWinter, Rift, Star Wars: The old republic, Swordsman Online, Tera Rising, The Secret World, Warframe and the list never drops. In fact, there are tons of F2P MMOrpgs and the problem is not that F2P exists as a business model, an alternative one to a subscription but the culture itself.
Cheap or Free does not guarantee quality. Anything good needs cash or some type of a strong long run investment. Period.
We all knew what would happen when Free 2 Play came around and mostly MMOers from the new age, were so passionate about the idea of FREE as if it meant FREEDOM and the whole mainstream press was embracing something in the same lines. What is ironical though is that the same press and new MMoers alike are steadily reaching the same conclusion - they are all reaching the same wall that old MMOers reached when the MMO market was stuck in the World of Warcraft era.
"We are bored. We need more. We want more".
And the consequences?
Reverse engineering - Instead of progressing forward to a more complete and unified MMOrpg genre it has dissected that genre into snacks and bites with incomplete PVE & PVP and hidden content through paywalls and paypals. Every single Free 2 Play MMOrpg right now is incomplete and lacks usually basic tools such as a good group finder. Progression has been backwards and that is exactly why we have got so many with disgusting graphics, generic character customization, unpolished combat and animations and bad level designs and environments. In all fronts, from story to gameplay, the F2P market will make sure that there is always going to be a core expectation missing in order to build up hype for the next generation of gamers.
Short life span - In every crisis or stale period, there are opportunities that whoever is the fastest and the smarter hits gold. Some MMOrpgs are good at doing that - filling up a hole through that particular period of stagnation; by taking advantage of the thirst of a niche MMO crowd such as the Lineage crowd with ArcheAge. Companies right now will not allow for complete MMOs to appear because there is no need to because the market is not at a good state nor competitive and there are way too many gaps.
Pipe dream – Option is good but it is not always good; when the minority dominates the majority that is unhealthy by default. Once one good subscription MMOrpg fulfils the gap in the market, the rest will get wiped, studios will close downs, jobs will be lost and so on and so forth. And there are two huge gaps - making a more refined MMOrpg of the past and making a more refined MMOrpg of that specific theme. If right now someone released the closest thing to a Skyrim multiplayer, ESO Online would go bankrupt.
Hideous purpose – F2P is all about money. Not just about money or some money. And the evidence comes from the very nature of the model ; you are just a free to play player from them; someone that plays their game for free; they do not have to listen to you, take your constructive criticism seriously; you have no authority or influence whatsoever; you are not entitled to anything. Pay2Win elements are often and if you dare to raise a voice you should not because you are not entitled to since you don’t pay money to the game. Hence you should be thankful to the “whales” to spend allot of money so you can play still play that game and still play it for free. And most importantly, regardless of how much money they make, they will never rival with the quality of a sub-based MMOrpg and it is pretty self-explanatory on why that is happening.
No expectations – That is right. Since you do not pay for anything you cannot expect anything. Standards can be as low as possible, the game can be as average as possible, customer service can be as non-existent as possible, floods of bots, goldsellers, spammers and hackers can be as big as possible, technical mess with high lag and spikes can be as often as possible and servers can be as ghost towns as possible. As long as the “whales” spend more money, have a reason to, everything else is irrelevant.
Forceful Adaptation – When you have no options because there is a lack of competition, you are forced to adapt. If you think Star Wars is the worst Star Wars, you will still play it because there is no other Star Wars to play. That creates a culture of taking breaks and painfully playing an MMO for the sake of being an MMO or due to boredom.
This has been one of the most ludicrous (for the business), subpar (for the genre) and ridiculous state of gaming where manipulative products of P2W dominate. This is like Steam flooded with indie games to justify that PC gaming is doing good and it still has the most exclusive titles when in reality most of them are byproducts of easy, cheap and intentionally lazy development. And in that respect, MMOs have become moneycash grabbing scheme like a bad Kickstarter project.
They will never attract millions of players because they don't deserve to attract millions of players. They are not that good and they do not want to be that good either. The intention of F2P MMOrpgs is not to make a great and complete MMOrpg experience but to cater to a niche and identify the whales which in turns become a money-grabbing marathon. That is why there is no loyalty from the playerbase. That is why they are not sub-based because they can never have many subs. There not again not that good and they can flood the market just like that.
We need competition because competition drives quality.
That is my argument and right now quality is secondary. Without competition, there are no standards, everything goes, there are no expectations. The culture behind F2P is a backward step.
No one else apart from you is responsible for this sub-par quantity and quality. -
disusedgenius 10,677 posts
Seen 2 days ago
Registered 14 years agoLeoliansBro wrote:
Even the bit about Forceful Adaptation?
neilka wrote:
Me neither.
0Authority wrote:
Not reading that
Edit: Will re-edit accordingly as I can't be bothered to do that now.
Societies deserve to have what they have - you deserve the police you have, you deserve the government you have, you deserve the politicians you have. Same thing with games.
Let us now have a closer look at the F2P market since it is the dominant force right now. The F2P supporters have always claimed that most people that play F2P are unemployed or low on income. That has been their thesis since the first day to draw more crowd away from the subscription model. "10-15 dollars a month is too much and most people given these circumstances cannot afford it", "You don't have to pay 10-15 dollars per month anymore to access the full game", "Forget subscription. It is dead" were positions widely accepted and commonly shared.
Considering how attractive and profitable the F2P model has become, if their positions were true or bared any truth that mean that since most are not unable to pay a sub on that amount then that meant most would not be able to pay any money on a F2P MMO. If we follow now the chain on this logic and translate it to numbers and thus percentages, it would mean that a 10% percent of the market, the "whale culture" as the industry calls them, would be enough to fund each F2P MMO.
However that whale culture would have to spend enough to cover monthly costs (all employees wages and payrolls, maintenance, technicians, customer support assistant, developers, servers, ect) which is not true. And it is not true because we do already know that every 1 out of 2 players gives a X amount of dollars per month and interesting enough (who would have thought eh?) that same player will definitely spend more money on a F2P game yearly than he would have spend on a subscription MMO.
It is also a given fact that mainly in Europe and NA, F2P MMOrpgs have got extremely low population. "Dead servers", "Ghost towns", "Full of hackers, bots and goldsellers" is indeed not only a very common perception but it has started to become an expectation of the free-to-play industry. Regardless of that and taken into account the revenues of the F2P sphere of influence, it is a logical fallacy to believe that a few "whales" in all F2P MMOrpgs are not only millionaires and billionaires but the primarily force for covering every single's F2P MMOrpg daily, monthly and yearly costs and hence the multi-million/billion empire.
As far as the demographics of this F2P playerbase, the information is simple and clear; the majority is not unemployed or on low income; the majority or alternatively "casuals" are usually family-oriented or workaholic individuals who do not have enough time to invest on a hardcore content driver MMO, and prefer to spend a few hours here and there on a standard F2P game.
In addition, I personally do not know millions or billions of unemployed or low-on-income players who can afford to maintain a medium-gaming ring including hidden costs (electricity, ect) but not afford a 10-15 payment per month on a sub-MMO.
So who the hell is this apparent vocal minority of not being able to afford a monthly sub?
They are freeriders and freeloaders, the jumping-wagon crowd that jumps from one MMO to another MMO within the first month hence the massive exodus that is apparent these days; they are the so called "jumpers". As it stands, this vocal minority is nothing more than a plague of constant leeches who expect others to sacrifice their own income so they can play anything for free without ever giving a dime back. Until they leave and go to the next F2P game and repeat.
More than usual you find this very verbal and vocal minority when a large amount legitimate paying customers or MMO veterans complain about the design of an apparently "Free to play" model which is 9 out of 10 not free, and more specifically freemium or Pay to win in hardcore gamers term. What is an irony though, is that these non-paying gamers always make an effort to stigmatize the paying gamers are
"gamers that do not want to pay anything and expect everything for free and expect Developers to work for free".
Next time you meet them ask them this question - "Why don't you start paying that much for once and support your beloved Developer that works extremely hard as well as its staff?" Since their position is that games are not free, then they should start putting money where their mouth is and in fact be the first ones to do so.
F2P culture apart from the evidently ridiculous community of rude kids, full-mouth brats and teenagers, it has got also negative side effects to the MMO scene as a whole. And here I explain it clearly,
Calling ALL Developers - Your games are Sub-par
Short version - If you do not support models of business that respect customers and give you full access of the game, you know FULL game, instead of hiding it behind paypals and paywalls; unlike great business models such as the one in League of Legends and Guild Wars 2 or any other MMO where cash shop only sells cosmetics, stop bitching and moaning about the state of MMOs because you are the exact reason about that state.
I have been playing MMOrpgs for 17 years now. I have invested in many time, effort, money, endless grind, top PVP or PVE player, hardcore or casual, Subscription/F2P/Freemium/B2P and you name it. I am a complete veteran of this genre.
This year and the previous one has been the worst year for this genre. Definitely the worse because instead of having MMOs trying to compete with the big players on the market such as World of Warcraft, Final Fantasy: A realm reborn, WildStar, Destiny, Blade & Soul, Phantasy Star Online 2 and Star Citizen and Kingdom Under Fire II we have games trying to compete with who is the more niche and how fast they can gain revenue by exploiting that niche market.
Let us have a look - Age of Wushu, Archlord 2, C9, Dragon Nest , Guild Wars 2, Firefall, Lord of the Rings, NeverWinter, Rift, Star Wars: The old republic, Swordsman Online, Tera Rising, The Secret World, Warframe and the list never drops. In fact, there are tons of F2P MMOrpgs and the problem is not that F2P exists as a business model, an alternative one to a subscription but the culture itself.
Cheap or Free does not guarantee quality. Anything good needs cash or some type of a strong long run investment. Period.
We all knew what would happen when Free 2 Play came around and mostly MMOers from the new age, were so passionate about the idea of FREE as if it meant FREEDOM and the whole mainstream press was embracing something in the same lines. What is ironical though is that the same press and new MMoers alike are steadily reaching the same conclusion - they are all reaching the same wall that old MMOers reached when the MMO market was stuck in the World of Warcraft era.
"We are bored. We need more. We want more".
And the consequences?
Reverse engineering - Instead of progressing forward to a more complete and unified MMOrpg genre it has dissected that genre into snacks and bites with incomplete PVE & PVP and hidden content through paywalls and paypals. Every single Free 2 Play MMOrpg right now is incomplete and lacks usually basic tools such as a good group finder. Progression has been backwards and that is exactly why we have got so many with disgusting graphics, generic character customization, unpolished combat and animations and bad level designs and environments. In all fronts, from story to gameplay, the F2P market will make sure that there is always going to be a core expectation missing in order to build up hype for the next generation of gamers.
Short life span - In every crisis or stale period, there are opportunities that whoever is the fastest and the smarter hits gold. Some MMOrpgs are good at doing that - filling up a hole through that particular period of stagnation; by taking advantage of the thirst of a niche MMO crowd such as the Lineage crowd with ArcheAge. Companies right now will not allow for complete MMOs to appear because there is no need to because the market is not at a good state nor competitive and there are way too many gaps.
Pipe dream – Option is good but it is not always good; when the minority dominates the majority that is unhealthy by default. Once one good subscription MMOrpg fulfils the gap in the market, the rest will get wiped, studios will close downs, jobs will be lost and so on and so forth. And there are two huge gaps - making a more refined MMOrpg of the past and making a more refined MMOrpg of that specific theme. If right now someone released the closest thing to a Skyrim multiplayer, ESO Online would go bankrupt.
Hideous purpose – F2P is all about money. Not just about money or some money. And the evidence comes from the very nature of the model ; you are just a free to play player from them; someone that plays their game for free; they do not have to listen to you, take your constructive criticism seriously; you have no authority or influence whatsoever; you are not entitled to anything. Pay2Win elements are often and if you dare to raise a voice you should not because you are not entitled to since you don’t pay money to the game. Hence you should be thankful to the “whales” to spend allot of money so you can play still play that game and still play it for free. And most importantly, regardless of how much money they make, they will never rival with the quality of a sub-based MMOrpg and it is pretty self-explanatory on why that is happening.
No expectations – That is right. Since you do not pay for anything you cannot expect anything. Standards can be as low as possible, the game can be as average as possible, customer service can be as non-existent as possible, floods of bots, goldsellers, spammers and hackers can be as big as possible, technical mess with high lag and spikes can be as often as possible and servers can be as ghost towns as possible. As long as the “whales” spend more money, have a reason to, everything else is irrelevant.
Forceful Adaptation – When you have no options because there is a lack of competition, you are forced to adapt. If you think Star Wars is the worst Star Wars, you will still play it because there is no other Star Wars to play. That creates a culture of taking breaks and painfully playing an MMO for the sake of being an MMO or due to boredom.
This has been one of the most ludicrous (for the business), subpar (for the genre) and ridiculous state of gaming where manipulative products of P2W dominate. This is like Steam flooded with indie games to justify that PC gaming is doing good and it still has the most exclusive titles when in reality most of them are byproducts of easy, cheap and intentionally lazy development. And in that respect, MMOs have become moneycash grabbing scheme like a bad Kickstarter project.
They will never attract millions of players because they don't deserve to attract millions of players. They are not that good and they do not want to be that good either. The intention of F2P MMOrpgs is not to make a great and complete MMOrpg experience but to cater to a niche and identify the whales which in turns become a money-grabbing marathon. That is why there is no loyalty from the playerbase. That is why they are not sub-based because they can never have many subs. There not again not that good and they can flood the market just like that.
We need competition because competition drives quality.
That is my argument and right now quality is secondary. Without competition, there are no standards, everything goes, there are no expectations. The culture behind F2P is a backward step.
No one else apart from you is responsible for this sub-par quantity and quality. -
minky-kong 14,787 posts
Seen 2 days ago
Registered 13 years agoLeoliansBro wrote:
Nor I.
neilka wrote:
Me neither.
0Authority wrote:
Not reading that
Edit: Will re-edit accordingly as I can't be bothered to do that now.
Societies deserve to have what they have - you deserve the police you have, you deserve the government you have, you deserve the politicians you have. Same thing with games.
Let us now have a closer look at the F2P market since it is the dominant force right now. The F2P supporters have always claimed that most people that play F2P are unemployed or low on income. That has been their thesis since the first day to draw more crowd away from the subscription model. "10-15 dollars a month is too much and most people given these circumstances cannot afford it", "You don't have to pay 10-15 dollars per month anymore to access the full game", "Forget subscription. It is dead" were positions widely accepted and commonly shared.
Considering how attractive and profitable the F2P model has become, if their positions were true or bared any truth that mean that since most are not unable to pay a sub on that amount then that meant most would not be able to pay any money on a F2P MMO. If we follow now the chain on this logic and translate it to numbers and thus percentages, it would mean that a 10% percent of the market, the "whale culture" as the industry calls them, would be enough to fund each F2P MMO.
However that whale culture would have to spend enough to cover monthly costs (all employees wages and payrolls, maintenance, technicians, customer support assistant, developers, servers, ect) which is not true. And it is not true because we do already know that every 1 out of 2 players gives a X amount of dollars per month and interesting enough (who would have thought eh?) that same player will definitely spend more money on a F2P game yearly than he would have spend on a subscription MMO.
It is also a given fact that mainly in Europe and NA, F2P MMOrpgs have got extremely low population. "Dead servers", "Ghost towns", "Full of hackers, bots and goldsellers" is indeed not only a very common perception but it has started to become an expectation of the free-to-play industry. Regardless of that and taken into account the revenues of the F2P sphere of influence, it is a logical fallacy to believe that a few "whales" in all F2P MMOrpgs are not only millionaires and billionaires but the primarily force for covering every single's F2P MMOrpg daily, monthly and yearly costs and hence the multi-million/billion empire.
As far as the demographics of this F2P playerbase, the information is simple and clear; the majority is not unemployed or on low income; the majority or alternatively "casuals" are usually family-oriented or workaholic individuals who do not have enough time to invest on a hardcore content driver MMO, and prefer to spend a few hours here and there on a standard F2P game.
In addition, I personally do not know millions or billions of unemployed or low-on-income players who can afford to maintain a medium-gaming ring including hidden costs (electricity, ect) but not afford a 10-15 payment per month on a sub-MMO.
So who the hell is this apparent vocal minority of not being able to afford a monthly sub?
They are freeriders and freeloaders, the jumping-wagon crowd that jumps from one MMO to another MMO within the first month hence the massive exodus that is apparent these days; they are the so called "jumpers". As it stands, this vocal minority is nothing more than a plague of constant leeches who expect others to sacrifice their own income so they can play anything for free without ever giving a dime back. Until they leave and go to the next F2P game and repeat.
More than usual you find this very verbal and vocal minority when a large amount legitimate paying customers or MMO veterans complain about the design of an apparently "Free to play" model which is 9 out of 10 not free, and more specifically freemium or Pay to win in hardcore gamers term. What is an irony though, is that these non-paying gamers always make an effort to stigmatize the paying gamers are
"gamers that do not want to pay anything and expect everything for free and expect Developers to work for free".
Next time you meet them ask them this question - "Why don't you start paying that much for once and support your beloved Developer that works extremely hard as well as its staff?" Since their position is that games are not free, then they should start putting money where their mouth is and in fact be the first ones to do so.
F2P culture apart from the evidently ridiculous community of rude kids, full-mouth brats and teenagers, it has got also negative side effects to the MMO scene as a whole. And here I explain it clearly,
Calling ALL Developers - Your games are Sub-par
Short version - If you do not support models of business that respect customers and give you full access of the game, you know FULL game, instead of hiding it behind paypals and paywalls; unlike great business models such as the one in League of Legends and Guild Wars 2 or any other MMO where cash shop only sells cosmetics, stop bitching and moaning about the state of MMOs because you are the exact reason about that state.
I have been playing MMOrpgs for 17 years now. I have invested in many time, effort, money, endless grind, top PVP or PVE player, hardcore or casual, Subscription/F2P/Freemium/B2P and you name it. I am a complete veteran of this genre.
This year and the previous one has been the worst year for this genre. Definitely the worse because instead of having MMOs trying to compete with the big players on the market such as World of Warcraft, Final Fantasy: A realm reborn, WildStar, Destiny, Blade & Soul, Phantasy Star Online 2 and Star Citizen and Kingdom Under Fire II we have games trying to compete with who is the more niche and how fast they can gain revenue by exploiting that niche market.
Let us have a look - Age of Wushu, Archlord 2, C9, Dragon Nest , Guild Wars 2, Firefall, Lord of the Rings, NeverWinter, Rift, Star Wars: The old republic, Swordsman Online, Tera Rising, The Secret World, Warframe and the list never drops. In fact, there are tons of F2P MMOrpgs and the problem is not that F2P exists as a business model, an alternative one to a subscription but the culture itself.
Cheap or Free does not guarantee quality. Anything good needs cash or some type of a strong long run investment. Period.
We all knew what would happen when Free 2 Play came around and mostly MMOers from the new age, were so passionate about the idea of FREE as if it meant FREEDOM and the whole mainstream press was embracing something in the same lines. What is ironical though is that the same press and new MMoers alike are steadily reaching the same conclusion - they are all reaching the same wall that old MMOers reached when the MMO market was stuck in the World of Warcraft era.
"We are bored. We need more. We want more".
And the consequences?
Reverse engineering - Instead of progressing forward to a more complete and unified MMOrpg genre it has dissected that genre into snacks and bites with incomplete PVE & PVP and hidden content through paywalls and paypals. Every single Free 2 Play MMOrpg right now is incomplete and lacks usually basic tools such as a good group finder. Progression has been backwards and that is exactly why we have got so many with disgusting graphics, generic character customization, unpolished combat and animations and bad level designs and environments. In all fronts, from story to gameplay, the F2P market will make sure that there is always going to be a core expectation missing in order to build up hype for the next generation of gamers.
Short life span - In every crisis or stale period, there are opportunities that whoever is the fastest and the smarter hits gold. Some MMOrpgs are good at doing that - filling up a hole through that particular period of stagnation; by taking advantage of the thirst of a niche MMO crowd such as the Lineage crowd with ArcheAge. Companies right now will not allow for complete MMOs to appear because there is no need to because the market is not at a good state nor competitive and there are way too many gaps.
Pipe dream – Option is good but it is not always good; when the minority dominates the majority that is unhealthy by default. Once one good subscription MMOrpg fulfils the gap in the market, the rest will get wiped, studios will close downs, jobs will be lost and so on and so forth. And there are two huge gaps - making a more refined MMOrpg of the past and making a more refined MMOrpg of that specific theme. If right now someone released the closest thing to a Skyrim multiplayer, ESO Online would go bankrupt.
Hideous purpose – F2P is all about money. Not just about money or some money. And the evidence comes from the very nature of the model ; you are just a free to play player from them; someone that plays their game for free; they do not have to listen to you, take your constructive criticism seriously; you have no authority or influence whatsoever; you are not entitled to anything. Pay2Win elements are often and if you dare to raise a voice you should not because you are not entitled to since you don’t pay money to the game. Hence you should be thankful to the “whales” to spend allot of money so you can play still play that game and still play it for free. And most importantly, regardless of how much money they make, they will never rival with the quality of a sub-based MMOrpg and it is pretty self-explanatory on why that is happening.
No expectations – That is right. Since you do not pay for anything you cannot expect anything. Standards can be as low as possible, the game can be as average as possible, customer service can be as non-existent as possible, floods of bots, goldsellers, spammers and hackers can be as big as possible, technical mess with high lag and spikes can be as often as possible and servers can be as ghost towns as possible. As long as the “whales” spend more money, have a reason to, everything else is irrelevant.
Forceful Adaptation – When you have no options because there is a lack of competition, you are forced to adapt. If you think Star Wars is the worst Star Wars, you will still play it because there is no other Star Wars to play. That creates a culture of taking breaks and painfully playing an MMO for the sake of being an MMO or due to boredom.
This has been one of the most ludicrous (for the business), subpar (for the genre) and ridiculous state of gaming where manipulative products of P2W dominate. This is like Steam flooded with indie games to justify that PC gaming is doing good and it still has the most exclusive titles when in reality most of them are byproducts of easy, cheap and intentionally lazy development. And in that respect, MMOs have become moneycash grabbing scheme like a bad Kickstarter project.
They will never attract millions of players because they don't deserve to attract millions of players. They are not that good and they do not want to be that good either. The intention of F2P MMOrpgs is not to make a great and complete MMOrpg experience but to cater to a niche and identify the whales which in turns become a money-grabbing marathon. That is why there is no loyalty from the playerbase. That is why they are not sub-based because they can never have many subs. There not again not that good and they can flood the market just like that.
We need competition because competition drives quality.
That is my argument and right now quality is secondary. Without competition, there are no standards, everything goes, there are no expectations. The culture behind F2P is a backward step.
No one else apart from you is responsible for this sub-par quantity and quality. -
0Authority wrote:
FTFY
Edit: Will re-edit accordingly as I can't be bothered to do that now.
Societies deserve to have what they have - you deserve the police you have, you deserve the government you have, you deserve the politicians you have. Same thing with games.
Let us now have a closer look at the F2P market since it is the dominant force right now. The F2P supporters have always claimed that most people that play F2P are unemployed or low on income. That has been their thesis since the first day to draw more crowd away from the subscription model. "10-15 dollars a month is too much and most people given these circumstances cannot afford it", "You don't have to pay 10-15 dollars per month anymore to access the full game", "Forget subscription. It is dead" were positions widely accepted and commonly shared.
Considering how attractive and profitable the F2P model has become, if their positions were true or bared any truth that mean that since most are not unable to pay a sub on that amount then that meant most would not be able to pay any money on a F2P MMO. If we follow now the chain on this logic and translate it to numbers and thus percentages, it would mean that a 10% percent of the market, the "whale culture" as the industry calls them, would be enough to fund each F2P MMO.
However that whale culture would have to spend enough to cover monthly costs (all employees wages and payrolls, maintenance, technicians, customer support assistant, developers, servers, ect) which is not true. And it is not true because we do already know that every 1 out of 2 players gives a X amount of dollars per month and interesting enough (who would have thought eh?) that same player will definitely spend more money on a F2P game yearly than he would have spend on a subscription MMO.
It is also a given fact that mainly in Europe and NA, F2P MMOrpgs have got extremely low population. "Dead servers", "Ghost towns", "Full of hackers, bots and goldsellers" is indeed not only a very common perception but it has started to become an expectation of the free-to-play industry. Regardless of that and taken into account the revenues of the F2P sphere of influence, it is a logical fallacy to believe that a few "whales" in all F2P MMOrpgs are not only millionaires and billionaires but the primarily force for covering every single's F2P MMOrpg daily, monthly and yearly costs and hence the multi-million/billion empire.
As far as the demographics of this F2P playerbase, the information is simple and clear; the majority is not unemployed or on low income; the majority or alternatively "casuals" are usually family-oriented or workaholic individuals who do not have enough time to invest on a hardcore content driver MMO, and prefer to spend a few hours here and there on a standard F2P game.
In addition, I personally do not know millions or billions of unemployed or low-on-income players who can afford to maintain a medium-gaming ring including hidden costs (electricity, ect) but not afford a 10-15 payment per month on a sub-MMO.
So who the hell is this apparent vocal minority of not being able to afford a monthly sub?
They are freeriders and freeloaders, the jumping-wagon crowd that jumps from one MMO to another MMO within the first month hence the massive exodus that is apparent these days; they are the so called "jumpers". As it stands, this vocal minority is nothing more than a plague of constant leeches who expect others to sacrifice their own income so they can play anything for free without ever giving a dime back. Until they leave and go to the next F2P game and repeat.
More than usual you find this very verbal and vocal minority when a large amount legitimate paying customers or MMO veterans complain about the design of an apparently "Free to play" model which is 9 out of 10 not free, and more specifically freemium or Pay to win in hardcore gamers term. What is an irony though, is that these non-paying gamers always make an effort to stigmatize the paying gamers are
"gamers that do not want to pay anything and expect everything for free and expect Developers to work for free".
Next time you meet them ask them this question - "Why don't you start paying that much for once and support your beloved Developer that works extremely hard as well as its staff?" Since their position is that games are not free, then they should start putting money where their mouth is and in fact be the first ones to do so.
F2P culture apart from the evidently ridiculous community of rude kids, full-mouth brats and teenagers, it has got also negative side effects to the MMO scene as a whole. And here I explain it clearly,
Calling ALL Developers - Your games are Sub-par
Short version - If you do not support models of business that respect customers and give you full access of the game, you know FULL game, instead of hiding it behind paypals and paywalls; unlike great business models such as the one in League of Legends and Guild Wars 2 or any other MMO where cash shop only sells cosmetics, stop bitching and moaning about the state of MMOs because you are the exact reason about that state.
I have been playing MMOrpgs for 17 years now. I have invested in many time, effort, money, endless grind, top PVP or PVE player, hardcore or casual, Subscription/F2P/Freemium/B2P and you name it. I am a complete veteran of this genre.
This year and the previous one has been the worst year for this genre. Definitely the worse because instead of having MMOs trying to compete with the big players on the market such as World of Warcraft, Final Fantasy: A realm reborn, WildStar, Destiny, Blade & Soul, Phantasy Star Online 2 and Star Citizen and Kingdom Under Fire II we have games trying to compete with who is the more niche and how fast they can gain revenue by exploiting that niche market.
Let us have a look - Age of Wushu, Archlord 2, C9, Dragon Nest , Guild Wars 2, Firefall, Lord of the Rings, NeverWinter, Rift, Star Wars: The old republic, Swordsman Online, Tera Rising, The Secret World, Warframe and the list never drops. In fact, there are tons of F2P MMOrpgs and the problem is not that F2P exists as a business model, an alternative one to a subscription but the culture itself.
Cheap or Free does not guarantee quality. Anything good needs cash or some type of a strong long run investment. Period.
We all knew what would happen when Free 2 Play came around and mostly MMOers from the new age, were so passionate about the idea of FREE as if it meant FREEDOM and the whole mainstream press was embracing something in the same lines. What is ironical though is that the same press and new MMoers alike are steadily reaching the same conclusion - they are all reaching the same wall that old MMOers reached when the MMO market was stuck in the World of Warcraft era.
"We are bored. We need more. We want more".
And the consequences?
Reverse engineering - Instead of progressing forward to a more complete and unified MMOrpg genre it has dissected that genre into snacks and bites with incomplete PVE & PVP and hidden content through paywalls and paypals. Every single Free 2 Play MMOrpg right now is incomplete and lacks usually basic tools such as a good group finder. Progression has been backwards and that is exactly why we have got so many with disgusting graphics, generic character customization, unpolished combat and animations and bad level designs and environments. In all fronts, from story to gameplay, the F2P market will make sure that there is always going to be a core expectation missing in order to build up hype for the next generation of gamers.
Short life span - In every crisis or stale period, there are opportunities that whoever is the fastest and the smarter hits gold. Some MMOrpgs are good at doing that - filling up a hole through that particular period of stagnation; by taking advantage of the thirst of a niche MMO crowd such as the Lineage crowd with ArcheAge. Companies right now will not allow for complete MMOs to appear because there is no need to because the market is not at a good state nor competitive and there are way too many gaps.
Pipe dream – Option is good but it is not always good; when the minority dominates the majority that is unhealthy by default. Once one good subscription MMOrpg fulfils the gap in the market, the rest will get wiped, studios will close downs, jobs will be lost and so on and so forth. And there are two huge gaps - making a more refined MMOrpg of the past and making a more refined MMOrpg of that specific theme. If right now someone released the closest thing to a Skyrim multiplayer, ESO Online would go bankrupt.
Hideous purpose – F2P is all about money. Not just about money or some money. And the evidence comes from the very nature of the model ; you are just a free to play player from them; someone that plays their game for free; they do not have to listen to you, take your constructive criticism seriously; you have no authority or influence whatsoever; you are not entitled to anything. Pay2Win elements are often and if you dare to raise a voice you should not because you are not entitled to since you don’t pay money to the game. Hence you should be thankful to the “whales” to spend allot of money so you can play still play that game and still play it for free. And most importantly, regardless of how much money they make, they will never rival with the quality of a sub-based MMOrpg and it is pretty self-explanatory on why that is happening.
No expectations – That is right. Since you do not pay for anything you cannot expect anything. Standards can be as low as possible, the game can be as average as possible, customer service can be as non-existent as possible, floods of bots, goldsellers, spammers and hackers can be as big as possible, technical mess with high lag and spikes can be as often as possible and servers can be as ghost towns as possible. As long as the “whales” spend more money, have a reason to, everything else is irrelevant.
Forceful Adaptation – When you have no options because there is a lack of competition, you are forced to adapt. If you think Star Wars is the worst Star Wars, you will still play it because there is no other Star Wars to play. That creates a culture of taking breaks and painfully playing an MMO for the sake of being an MMO or due to boredom.
This has been one of the most ludicrous (for the business), subpar (for the genre) and ridiculous state of gaming where manipulative products of P2W dominate. This is like Steam flooded with indie games to justify that PC gaming is doing good and it still has the most exclusive titles when in reality most of them are byproducts of easy, cheap and intentionally lazy development. And in that respect, MMOs have become moneycash grabbing scheme like a bad Kickstarter project.
They will never attract millions of players because they don't deserve to attract millions of players. They are not that good and they do not want to be that good either. The intention of F2P MMOrpgs is not to make a great and complete MMOrpg experience but to cater to a niche and identify the whales which in turns become a money-grabbing marathon. That is why there is no loyalty from the playerbase. That is why they are not sub-based because they can never have many subs. There not again not that good and they can flood the market just like that.
We need competition because competition drives quality.
That is my argument and right now quality is secondary. Without competition, there are no standards, everything goes, there are no expectations. The culture behind F2P is a backward step.
No one else apart from you is responsible for this sub-par quantity and quality.
Try and find it, I dare you -
'Michael, I can't accept this for your 'what I did during Summer Holidays' essay, you get an F' -
oldskooldeano 3,496 posts
Seen 16 hours ago
Registered 18 years agoThat's Fucked up yo.
And please don't quote the OP as I'm getting RSI from the scrolling. -
Tryhard 12,014 posts
Seen 4 years ago
Registered 11 years agoWhat just happened? -
Load_2.0 33,582 posts
Seen 8 hours ago
Registered 18 years agoLol, that took days to write.
And no one gives a fuck.
Anyway knock knock -
Duffking 16,964 posts
Seen 6 hours ago
Registered 15 years agoHello all. I’m Ascari from GTHD. As you know I was the highest ranked player on GTHD. GTHD was used as a test game, so that the people at Polyphony Digital could use the information gathered from players using the game, to improve their physics engine. That’s why it was free. You may also remember holl01. holl01 was very fast but he had a very unrealistic way of driving. The first way they changed the physics engine, was so holl01 couldn’t drive the way he was, because he was making them look bad. I had a more realistic way of driving and from the very start of GTHD they were making minor changes to the code and the physics because of this. Most of you who use the wheel, will have felt the improvements since then. They were making constant changes to the physics engine from the start, but when I started to use their drift physics engine, that’s when they began to build the whole system around me, in real time.
At this point, it was 6 months since GTHD started, and the competition had closed. I did more physical work over the next 3 months than anyone ever has, and with all the information they had gathered from this testing, they developed a new type of code. It was obvious this new code had to run at a certain speed, so they developed a system where the code was running through my wheel, so they could find out, how fast it needed to run.
They ran this code at a certain speed and I went faster. So they rebuilt, to meet this new speed, and again I went faster. This went on until I was having a lot of trouble keeping up with the speed. Eventually I managed to beat it and when I did, I noticed that my arm was light. Then everything around me turned into light. I was light and all I could see was light.
What had happened was, I kept beating the speed the code was running at, over and over until it was running, just below the speed of light. I then eventually managed to beat it to the speed of light, and in doing so, brought binary code to the speed of light. I didn’t know what speed it was running at, so this came as a surprise to me. I was just trying to go faster and beat it.
With code running at the speed of light, there were a lot of new ways to test the car. So the next test worth mentioning was, the test that found the points of inertia. They couldn’t find the points of inertia by making calculations. I had to do it practically. They set up a certain test, where the weight left the middle of the car and travelled to the rear axle, because they knew there had to be points in that area. I managed to find the first two points that are located on both sides of the rear axle, by forcing the weight to pass through these points, and this showed them how to find the rest. Eventually they found all the points of inertia and it lead to a system where there is a mathematically perfect cross above the car and a halo around the car. At times, the weight will leave the car and return. This system controls how the weight does that. It is not a virtual system, it was found and proven scientifically and it exists in real life. This system has always been there, waiting to be found. All that was needed to find it was binary code that was travelling at the speed of light, which is capable of making these tests possible and me.
The next interesting thing that happened was, what happened with the code itself. When I brought it to the speed of light, this was something very special and I became emotionally attached to it. Through all the testing that was going on, now for about 11 months, my mind got to know it and I was able to find it’s weak points and break it. I broke it 4 more times since it was brought to the speed of light, until it was unbreakable. Then I suggested to them that they assume there is only light because that’s what I saw when I first brought the code to the speed of light. I figured it was worth a try. The theory held and within their system there was only light. Proving what I had seen. At the time, I could barely believe what I saw. Powerful, Infinite light isn’t something you see everyday. I thought what I might have seen, was the code reaching the speed of light, and it just appeared to be everywhere, but the light I saw was everywhere around me and the fact that the theory held, proves what I saw and when I say it was powerful, I mean powerful.
So at this stage the code was everywhere, within their system, but it was not stable. Using what I can only call mind power, I managed to draw the code from where it was being introduced. In doing this, I made the code perfect. Hard to believe, I know, but I had been testing for a year at this stage and my mind knew the code, inside out. The code was now perfect light, just like I had seen in real life but it was nothing compared to the real thing.
So there you have it. Proof that God exists and what he looks like and proof that Jesus was, who he said he was. This also proves that there are 5 dimensions. Not 26 like any scientist will tell you. The fifth dimension is God. I saw this and then I proved it.
I went along with this process because these people gave me their word I would be paid for my time and I would get a trial with a racing team. I figured, after more physical work than anyone has ever done, all these evolutionary leaps, the proof that God exists, finding the points of inertia that lead to the cross and making the perfect code, that I earned my way onto a track. Looking back on it, I feel like a fool. I never signed a contract because I was going on trust, like a fool.
Now a year on, I have been left with nothing. I failed college, nearly had a heart attack at one point due to the stress of the testing, and contributed more to this process than anyone else involved. They stole a year of my life and all my ability. I thought the GT people were decent people so that’s why I went along with it. I can inform you, that if you become associated with the GT people in any way, you will be treated like a dog who, is supposed to jump through hoops. If you don’t jump through hoops, they will lose face and you will suffer and they can’t be trusted. They are thieves of the highest order.
Also, this code is very dangerous. As far as I know Sony have military contracts. Some parts of the PS3 are used in weapons technology. I am responsible for this code, and I finished it, but because I never signed a contract, I have no rights to it and no say in how it’s used. If it’s used for military weapons, it will be on my conscience. The code is God’s image. This company is going to patent it and sell it. This is wrong.
You may find all of this hard to believe and I don’t blame you. It’s a lot to comprehend, but I swear to God, it’s all true. This process happened because I have a very good practical understanding of physics and I was forcing the car to react, as it should in real life, but it wasn’t. They realised this, and that’s why they started building the physics engine around me. The longer the process went on, the more complicated things got, and the information they gathered from all my testing, lead to this new type of code. Then when I brought this code to the speed of light, that’s when everything got a little, outside the box. I transcended matter, saw the light, which is God and brought binary code with me and then I proved it. I then found the first 2 points of inertia that lead to the cross.
I’m asking all of you to stop playing GT until this is sorted out. I started, and contributed more to a process that proved that God exists and Jesus was his son. All I want is, to get onto a track and I think I’ve earned that. These people stole a year of my life and all my ability. If you stop playing, it will be only for a short time until they compensate me for the last year of my life. Since this ended, they have updated the PS3 contracts so, if I go through this process with another company like Microsoft, they will be able to take me to court. My ability is all I have, so I’m not signing any contracts, and as a result I can’t use my PS3 anymore. My advice to everyone who uses consoles like the PS3 is, to be aware that these game developers are using you to make their software work better, and they can just take your intellectual property, and sue you in court if you try to do the same with another company.
There is a God, Jesus was his son and I’m responsible for finding the proof. All I ask in return, is that you stop playing this video game until there is some justice. Please help me out. -
GameCriticDOTcoDOTuk 551 posts
Seen 11 months ago
Registered 7 years agoGaming Elitism goes way beyond MMO's. Gaming sites and their extreme gamut of favoured reviews promote overhyping the good and exaggerating the so called bad. This has spread onto gamers like wildfire and now niche games and new IP's don't get the support they deserve.
There's only so much cake in the industry. -
saintedd 317 posts
Seen 1 year ago
Registered 13 years agoDUFFKING wrote:
Not reading that either.
Hello all. I’m Ascari from GTHD. As you know I was the highest ranked player on GTHD. GTHD was used as a test game, so that the people at Polyphony Digital could use the information gathered from players using the game, to improve their physics engine. That’s why it was free. You may also remember holl01. holl01 was very fast but he had a very unrealistic way of driving. The first way they changed the physics engine, was so holl01 couldn’t drive the way he was, because he was making them look bad. I had a more realistic way of driving and from the very start of GTHD they were making minor changes to the code and the physics because of this. Most of you who use the wheel, will have felt the improvements since then. They were making constant changes to the physics engine from the start, but when I started to use their drift physics engine, that’s when they began to build the whole system around me, in real time.
At this point, it was 6 months since GTHD started, and the competition had closed. I did more physical work over the next 3 months than anyone ever has, and with all the information they had gathered from this testing, they developed a new type of code. It was obvious this new code had to run at a certain speed, so they developed a system where the code was running through my wheel, so they could find out, how fast it needed to run.
They ran this code at a certain speed and I went faster. So they rebuilt, to meet this new speed, and again I went faster. This went on until I was having a lot of trouble keeping up with the speed. Eventually I managed to beat it and when I did, I noticed that my arm was light. Then everything around me turned into light. I was light and all I could see was light.
What had happened was, I kept beating the speed the code was running at, over and over until it was running, just below the speed of light. I then eventually managed to beat it to the speed of light, and in doing so, brought binary code to the speed of light. I didn’t know what speed it was running at, so this came as a surprise to me. I was just trying to go faster and beat it.
With code running at the speed of light, there were a lot of new ways to test the car. So the next test worth mentioning was, the test that found the points of inertia. They couldn’t find the points of inertia by making calculations. I had to do it practically. They set up a certain test, where the weight left the middle of the car and travelled to the rear axle, because they knew there had to be points in that area. I managed to find the first two points that are located on both sides of the rear axle, by forcing the weight to pass through these points, and this showed them how to find the rest. Eventually they found all the points of inertia and it lead to a system where there is a mathematically perfect cross above the car and a halo around the car. At times, the weight will leave the car and return. This system controls how the weight does that. It is not a virtual system, it was found and proven scientifically and it exists in real life. This system has always been there, waiting to be found. All that was needed to find it was binary code that was travelling at the speed of light, which is capable of making these tests possible and me.
The next interesting thing that happened was, what happened with the code itself. When I brought it to the speed of light, this was something very special and I became emotionally attached to it. Through all the testing that was going on, now for about 11 months, my mind got to know it and I was able to find it’s weak points and break it. I broke it 4 more times since it was brought to the speed of light, until it was unbreakable. Then I suggested to them that they assume there is only light because that’s what I saw when I first brought the code to the speed of light. I figured it was worth a try. The theory held and within their system there was only light. Proving what I had seen. At the time, I could barely believe what I saw. Powerful, Infinite light isn’t something you see everyday. I thought what I might have seen, was the code reaching the speed of light, and it just appeared to be everywhere, but the light I saw was everywhere around me and the fact that the theory held, proves what I saw and when I say it was powerful, I mean powerful.
So at this stage the code was everywhere, within their system, but it was not stable. Using what I can only call mind power, I managed to draw the code from where it was being introduced. In doing this, I made the code perfect. Hard to believe, I know, but I had been testing for a year at this stage and my mind knew the code, inside out. The code was now perfect light, just like I had seen in real life but it was nothing compared to the real thing.
So there you have it. Proof that God exists and what he looks like and proof that Jesus was, who he said he was. This also proves that there are 5 dimensions. Not 26 like any scientist will tell you. The fifth dimension is God. I saw this and then I proved it.
I went along with this process because these people gave me their word I would be paid for my time and I would get a trial with a racing team. I figured, after more physical work than anyone has ever done, all these evolutionary leaps, the proof that God exists, finding the points of inertia that lead to the cross and making the perfect code, that I earned my way onto a track. Looking back on it, I feel like a fool. I never signed a contract because I was going on trust, like a fool.
Now a year on, I have been left with nothing. I failed college, nearly had a heart attack at one point due to the stress of the testing, and contributed more to this process than anyone else involved. They stole a year of my life and all my ability. I thought the GT people were decent people so that’s why I went along with it. I can inform you, that if you become associated with the GT people in any way, you will be treated like a dog who, is supposed to jump through hoops. If you don’t jump through hoops, they will lose face and you will suffer and they can’t be trusted. They are thieves of the highest order.
Also, this code is very dangerous. As far as I know Sony have military contracts. Some parts of the PS3 are used in weapons technology. I am responsible for this code, and I finished it, but because I never signed a contract, I have no rights to it and no say in how it’s used. If it’s used for military weapons, it will be on my conscience. The code is God’s image. This company is going to patent it and sell it. This is wrong.
You may find all of this hard to believe and I don’t blame you. It’s a lot to comprehend, but I swear to God, it’s all true. This process happened because I have a very good practical understanding of physics and I was forcing the car to react, as it should in real life, but it wasn’t. They realised this, and that’s why they started building the physics engine around me. The longer the process went on, the more complicated things got, and the information they gathered from all my testing, lead to this new type of code. Then when I brought this code to the speed of light, that’s when everything got a little, outside the box. I transcended matter, saw the light, which is God and brought binary code with me and then I proved it. I then found the first 2 points of inertia that lead to the cross.
I’m asking all of you to stop playing GT until this is sorted out. I started, and contributed more to a process that proved that God exists and Jesus was his son. All I want is, to get onto a track and I think I’ve earned that. These people stole a year of my life and all my ability. If you stop playing, it will be only for a short time until they compensate me for the last year of my life. Since this ended, they have updated the PS3 contracts so, if I go through this process with another company like Microsoft, they will be able to take me to court. My ability is all I have, so I’m not signing any contracts, and as a result I can’t use my PS3 anymore. My advice to everyone who uses consoles like the PS3 is, to be aware that these game developers are using you to make their software work better, and they can just take your intellectual property, and sue you in court if you try to do the same with another company.
There is a God, Jesus was his son and I’m responsible for finding the proof. All I ask in return, is that you stop playing this video game until there is some justice. Please help me out. -
Dirtbox 92,595 posts
Seen 13 hours ago
Registered 19 years ago -
GameCriticDOTcoDOTuk 551 posts
Seen 11 months ago
Registered 7 years agoMMO developer's need to get into the console industry. The gap is titanic and the competition non existent. Yes, there are costs and limitations there because of Microsoft and Sony's strict policies but there has to be a breakthrough eventually. Fans and gamers have suffered for too long.
We have not had the promise of proper MMO on a console since True Fantasy Live Online got cancelled in 2005.
Diablo 3 is a nice step forward but it's not PURE! -
Dirtbox 92,595 posts
Seen 13 hours ago
Registered 19 years ago -
saintedd wrote:
Oh you really should.
Not reading that either. -
GameCriticDOTcoDOTuk 551 posts
Seen 11 months ago
Registered 7 years agoDirtbox wrote:
Sir, I was responding to the OP and I am not the OP yet you choose to attack me as a newcomer. Your attack was unsolicited and I don't usually acknowledge such with an answer.
www.gamecritic.co.uk appears to not exist.
How about you register it and post your fucking drivel on that instead?
I can only deduce you fear newcomers on this forum and this is a mark of territory in order to protect yourself and your boundaries. I impinge on no one. I will let you off this one time but next time I'm pressing the sacred ignore button. -
BillMurray 9,736 posts
Seen 3 days ago
Registered 13 years agoGameCriticDOTcoDOTuk wrote:
Edit* Nevermind!
MMO developer's need to get into the console industry. The gap is titanic and the competition non existent. Yes, there are costs and limitations there because of Microsoft and Sony's strict policies but there has to be a breakthrough eventually. Fans and gamers have suffered for too long.
We have not had the promise of proper MMO on a console since True Fantasy Live Online got cancelled in 2005.
Diablo 3 is a nice step forward but it's not PURE!
Edited by BillMurray at 18:49:16 24-07-2014 -
BinaryBob101 27,755 posts
Seen 7 days ago
Registered 12 years agosaintedd wrote:
Yeah, this is vizzini at his hilarious best.
DUFFKING wrote:
Not reading that either.
Hello all. I’m Ascari from GTHD. As you know I was the highest ranked player on GTHD. GTHD was used as a test game, so that the people at Polyphony Digital could use the information gathered from players using the game, to improve their physics engine. That’s why it was free. You may also remember holl01. holl01 was very fast but he had a very unrealistic way of driving. The first way they changed the physics engine, was so holl01 couldn’t drive the way he was, because he was making them look bad. I had a more realistic way of driving and from the very start of GTHD they were making minor changes to the code and the physics because of this. Most of you who use the wheel, will have felt the improvements since then. They were making constant changes to the physics engine from the start, but when I started to use their drift physics engine, that’s when they began to build the whole system around me, in real time.
At this point, it was 6 months since GTHD started, and the competition had closed. I did more physical work over the next 3 months than anyone ever has, and with all the information they had gathered from this testing, they developed a new type of code. It was obvious this new code had to run at a certain speed, so they developed a system where the code was running through my wheel, so they could find out, how fast it needed to run.
They ran this code at a certain speed and I went faster. So they rebuilt, to meet this new speed, and again I went faster. This went on until I was having a lot of trouble keeping up with the speed. Eventually I managed to beat it and when I did, I noticed that my arm was light. Then everything around me turned into light. I was light and all I could see was light.
What had happened was, I kept beating the speed the code was running at, over and over until it was running, just below the speed of light. I then eventually managed to beat it to the speed of light, and in doing so, brought binary code to the speed of light. I didn’t know what speed it was running at, so this came as a surprise to me. I was just trying to go faster and beat it.
With code running at the speed of light, there were a lot of new ways to test the car. So the next test worth mentioning was, the test that found the points of inertia. They couldn’t find the points of inertia by making calculations. I had to do it practically. They set up a certain test, where the weight left the middle of the car and travelled to the rear axle, because they knew there had to be points in that area. I managed to find the first two points that are located on both sides of the rear axle, by forcing the weight to pass through these points, and this showed them how to find the rest. Eventually they found all the points of inertia and it lead to a system where there is a mathematically perfect cross above the car and a halo around the car. At times, the weight will leave the car and return. This system controls how the weight does that. It is not a virtual system, it was found and proven scientifically and it exists in real life. This system has always been there, waiting to be found. All that was needed to find it was binary code that was travelling at the speed of light, which is capable of making these tests possible and me.
The next interesting thing that happened was, what happened with the code itself. When I brought it to the speed of light, this was something very special and I became emotionally attached to it. Through all the testing that was going on, now for about 11 months, my mind got to know it and I was able to find it’s weak points and break it. I broke it 4 more times since it was brought to the speed of light, until it was unbreakable. Then I suggested to them that they assume there is only light because that’s what I saw when I first brought the code to the speed of light. I figured it was worth a try. The theory held and within their system there was only light. Proving what I had seen. At the time, I could barely believe what I saw. Powerful, Infinite light isn’t something you see everyday. I thought what I might have seen, was the code reaching the speed of light, and it just appeared to be everywhere, but the light I saw was everywhere around me and the fact that the theory held, proves what I saw and when I say it was powerful, I mean powerful.
So at this stage the code was everywhere, within their system, but it was not stable. Using what I can only call mind power, I managed to draw the code from where it was being introduced. In doing this, I made the code perfect. Hard to believe, I know, but I had been testing for a year at this stage and my mind knew the code, inside out. The code was now perfect light, just like I had seen in real life but it was nothing compared to the real thing.
So there you have it. Proof that God exists and what he looks like and proof that Jesus was, who he said he was. This also proves that there are 5 dimensions. Not 26 like any scientist will tell you. The fifth dimension is God. I saw this and then I proved it.
I went along with this process because these people gave me their word I would be paid for my time and I would get a trial with a racing team. I figured, after more physical work than anyone has ever done, all these evolutionary leaps, the proof that God exists, finding the points of inertia that lead to the cross and making the perfect code, that I earned my way onto a track. Looking back on it, I feel like a fool. I never signed a contract because I was going on trust, like a fool.
Now a year on, I have been left with nothing. I failed college, nearly had a heart attack at one point due to the stress of the testing, and contributed more to this process than anyone else involved. They stole a year of my life and all my ability. I thought the GT people were decent people so that’s why I went along with it. I can inform you, that if you become associated with the GT people in any way, you will be treated like a dog who, is supposed to jump through hoops. If you don’t jump through hoops, they will lose face and you will suffer and they can’t be trusted. They are thieves of the highest order.
Also, this code is very dangerous. As far as I know Sony have military contracts. Some parts of the PS3 are used in weapons technology. I am responsible for this code, and I finished it, but because I never signed a contract, I have no rights to it and no say in how it’s used. If it’s used for military weapons, it will be on my conscience. The code is God’s image. This company is going to patent it and sell it. This is wrong.
You may find all of this hard to believe and I don’t blame you. It’s a lot to comprehend, but I swear to God, it’s all true. This process happened because I have a very good practical understanding of physics and I was forcing the car to react, as it should in real life, but it wasn’t. They realised this, and that’s why they started building the physics engine around me. The longer the process went on, the more complicated things got, and the information they gathered from all my testing, lead to this new type of code. Then when I brought this code to the speed of light, that’s when everything got a little, outside the box. I transcended matter, saw the light, which is God and brought binary code with me and then I proved it. I then found the first 2 points of inertia that lead to the cross.
I’m asking all of you to stop playing GT until this is sorted out. I started, and contributed more to a process that proved that God exists and Jesus was his son. All I want is, to get onto a track and I think I’ve earned that. These people stole a year of my life and all my ability. If you stop playing, it will be only for a short time until they compensate me for the last year of my life. Since this ended, they have updated the PS3 contracts so, if I go through this process with another company like Microsoft, they will be able to take me to court. My ability is all I have, so I’m not signing any contracts, and as a result I can’t use my PS3 anymore. My advice to everyone who uses consoles like the PS3 is, to be aware that these game developers are using you to make their software work better, and they can just take your intellectual property, and sue you in court if you try to do the same with another company.
There is a God, Jesus was his son and I’m responsible for finding the proof. All I ask in return, is that you stop playing this video game until there is some justice. Please help me out. -
LockeTribal 4,740 posts
Seen 14 hours ago
Registered 14 years agoHe's letting you off this once Dirtbox! Don't push your luck, who knows what he's capable of! -
GameCriticDOTcoDOTuk 551 posts
Seen 11 months ago
Registered 7 years agoLockeTribal wrote:
I had no idea the word cake was a trigger for this young veteran.
He's letting you off this once Dirtbox! Don't push your luck, who knows what he's capable of!
Never enter the Jungle without a map. -
Duffking 16,964 posts
Seen 6 hours ago
Registered 15 years agoMrTomFTW wrote:
It's a modern classic, of sorts.
saintedd wrote:
Oh you really should.
Not reading that either. -
GameCriticDOTcoDOTuk 551 posts
Seen 11 months ago
Registered 7 years agoDirtbox wrote:
Again, are you addressing me? Surely you must have realised I am not the OP.
Are you a bot?
'Bot'? Sorry I don't address the vernacular.
-
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