Following Making a Murderer Netflix show like Serial

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  • The-Bodybuilder 27 Dec 2015 19:15:45 17,540 posts
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    Just about to finish this show. Gut-wrenching stuff. Emotional rollercoaster. Whether it's true or not, one thing I can say for sure is that the JS criminal system is scary as f*ck. Not just what happens in the show, but the fact it corroborates with recent high profile cases in the US and lack of accountability by the police.
  • Youthist 27 Dec 2015 19:23:30 13,624 posts
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    It reads true enough to me. Disgraceful.
  • The-Bodybuilder 27 Dec 2015 19:59:55 17,540 posts
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    It's hard not to believe it, especially if you look at the evidence only, especially the revelation of the DA in the final episode, and how his own letter revealed they knew about the DA's own activities and covered up for him.

    How does one ever beat the system?
  • SuperCoolEskimo 27 Dec 2015 23:13:44 11,430 posts
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    One thing that confused me is how little the mattress is mentioned. From what I remember we never found out whether it was tested for DNA, which you'd think must have happened given the prosecution's story.

    The scariest thing for me was the press's role in that period between Avery's arrest and the trial. It was almost another voice for the prosecution.
  • Dirtbox 27 Dec 2015 23:21:26 91,020 posts
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    Post deleted
  • jonsaan 27 Dec 2015 23:22:49 26,898 posts
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    You're obviously not watching it properly DB.

    \has not watched it either
  • Deleted user 28 December 2015 01:11:28
    I stuck it on for a watch and ended up burning through the first 3 eps effortlessly.  Would watch more but a guy my age needs a bit of sleep.  Well, I need a LOT but I make do with a BIT.  Of sleep.  Yeah, SLEEP.
  • THFourteen 28 Dec 2015 08:28:58 51,175 posts
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    He's watching it on a PC that's probably why it sucks.
  • mothercruncher 28 Dec 2015 08:46:23 15,936 posts
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    Interesting and depressing. Perfect for me then.
  • Youthist 28 Dec 2015 09:47:54 13,624 posts
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    Finished it last night.



    It is simply unbelievable to me that anyone can believe that kid had anything to do with this regardless of Steve Avery guilt or innocence. There is not a single piece of evidence outside of the utterly bullshit "confession" tapes. And yet all appeals are turned down. It is clear as day that he has done nothing.

    As for Avery to me it is startling clear that there are so many holes in every single piece of the prosecutions case - huge ones - there is simply no way he should be in prison
    for this murder. The defence tore their case to shreds at each step.

    The police framed him for sure. Sickening .

  • L0cky 28 Dec 2015 09:50:50 2,035 posts
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    Note the first episode is officially free on YouTube (HD). By the end I couldn't believe it wasn't a single episode documentary, they're still not finished with the guy...

    Must watch the rest.

    https://youtu.be/34M2zdLc-2U
  • funkstar 28 Dec 2015 12:54:06 3,280 posts
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    @SuperCoolEskimo the DNA tester woman said no mattress had been asked to be tested
  • The-Bodybuilder 28 Dec 2015 13:04:05 17,540 posts
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    SuperCoolEskimo wrote:
    One thing that confused me is how little the mattress is mentioned. From what I remember we never found out whether it was tested for DNA, which you'd think must have happened given the prosecution's story.

    The scariest thing for me was the press's role in that period between Avery's arrest and the trial. It was almost another voice for the prosecution.
    She was never asked to test it (the forensic lady), but yet the tested the room for DNA. No trace of blood as described of Brandan's "original" account (the same account they did him on) anywhere in that room, or even trace of Brendan.

    I'm actually more surprised more case wasn't made for the blood vial. Regardless of the lack of EDTA or not (which in itself was questionable), the fact that the defence didn't make a strong enough question for why the fuck was the only single evidence held by the county had clearly been accessed, with all it's seal broken and a clear needle mark at the top of the vial was there when it wasn't before, why it was that everyone at the sheriff county had master key to access this, including the one office (that Lenk dude) who just so happened to be the person that originally filed for the handling of the blood vial in the 80s (and thus one of the few people that knew of the existence of the blood).


    Edited by The-Bodybuilder at 13:09:40 28-12-2015
  • The-Bodybuilder 28 Dec 2015 13:08:38 17,540 posts
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    Youthist wrote:
    Finished it last night.



    It is simply unbelievable to me that anyone can believe that kid had anything to do with this regardless of Steve Avery guilt or innocence. There is not a single piece of evidence outside of the utterly bullshit "confession" tapes. And yet all appeals are turned down. It is clear as day that he has done nothing.

    As for Avery to me it is startling clear that there are so many holes in every single piece of the prosecutions case - huge ones - there is simply no way he should be in prison
    for this murder. The defence tore their case to shreds at each step.

    The police framed him for sure. Sickening .

    It's remarkable that above all else and all things....Brendan gets done for the same charges that the state dropped against Steven because it was deemed so unreliable that it would help Steve, yet it was enough to lock up the kid? Even worse, the one charge that Steve was found not guilty of (destroying the body, ironically, the one evidence that they had), is the same charge they used against the kid. How the f*ck is that even possible to admit the same charge is inadmissable for Steven, but perfectly fine for Brendan? Madness.
  • The-Bodybuilder 28 Dec 2015 13:22:04 17,540 posts
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    I'm not one for conspiracies, but anyone who's finished watching the show should give this testimony a watch

    Quick summary:
    - The dude was an original witness of the first "Steven rape" case.
    - Lived in the same town or near it for most of his life.
    - Released this series of videos about a month before the show even came out.
    - Speaks of strange going on of the town.
    - Speaks of constantly being harassed by influential town people to join their "club", which he needs to do if he needs to go any further in his career.
    - Speaks of another suspicious death a woman he knew in the 80s.
    - Woman was harassed for days by unknown people and phone calls sounds similar to this Teresa lady in the show, who in court it was mentioned she was getting phone calls days before she disappears, of which her voicemails were deleted. But the court judge prevented them from looking any further or mentioning any more into that.
    - Club was full of influential town people; from teachers to coaches to police people to judges.
    - A major factor for why he refused to join the club was because he was abused by said club when he was 8 years old, as the club were part of a lot of sexual activity, especially with kids.

    It's the last 2 bits that get me. The last bit I would normally ignore, if it weren't for the recent revelations of the Westminster peadophile ring and its cover ups (still questioned now).

    I only mention it because by the end of the show, it becomes veeeery obvious that there's something not right with the system there, including the judge who consistently turns down Brendan's appeal and was the one who ensured the videos of his interviews weren't used in the original case. It's all very shady how a judge can have all that information and still not even request at least a retrial.
  • The-Bodybuilder 28 Dec 2015 13:24:43 17,540 posts
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    Also note how that DA attourney's recent revelations of of abusing his power to coerce abuse victims into his sexual demands, and then in his letter to the DA, hints at a threat to "remember his role in the Avery case" .

    The state then suspends his license.....for only 4 months.
    Some real shady stuff, man. The US Justice System is scary.

    Edited by The-Bodybuilder at 13:25:36 28-12-2015
  • arty 28 Dec 2015 17:05:48 495 posts
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    Does the Netflix series mention the 'sex club' that the youtube guy mentions?
  • funkstar 28 Dec 2015 17:21:47 3,280 posts
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    @arty nah it's not mentioned at all
  • lovely-cozen 28 Dec 2015 17:22:52 17 posts
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    are there any good articles which address/debunk the narrative put forward in the series? I really need to read something like that if only to lower my blood pressure
  • [maven] 28 Dec 2015 21:43:26 5,610 posts
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    I usually hate this type of documentaries, but I found this fascinating (and sad / scary).
  • CosmicFuzz 28 Dec 2015 22:02:55 32,583 posts
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    Watched first episode tonight, really enjoyed it.
  • SuperCoolEskimo 28 Dec 2015 22:49:38 11,430 posts
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    @lovely-cozen No but what I did subsequently read about the jury was that it included a man whose son worked for the Manitowoc County Sheriff's Department and a man whose wife worked for the Manitowoc County clerk of courts office at the time of the trial.

    Hope that helps your blood pressure.
  • Youthist 28 Dec 2015 23:11:09 13,624 posts
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    The reason there was no mention of a mattress in the trial is because there was no dna evidence on the mattress. Or anywhere in the house including the bedroom and the garage. Or of the kids dna while we are at it. Yes they slit her throat shot her in the head and then cleansed the garage so there was not a single piece of dna evidence left in that garage. I am sure these two had the skills to do that. Oh and right in the middle of all of this Steves girlfriend calls him and he pretends everything is fine and acts totally normally on the phone.

    In fact her blood and dna was found in the back of her car - so why was she bleeding in her own boot again if she was killed on the property?

    Oh and the other place her dna was found was in the fire pit. Loads of her bones were discovered there and a few fragments elsewhere. What is more likely - burned somewhere else then moved (leaving a few fragments behind) or burned in that pit then a few fragments taken elsewhere ? Makes zero sense.

    Finally I loved the fact the car key only had averys dna on it. Are you kidding me?

    Also did you notice that when the guilty verdict was announced in court on Brian, , the closest officer to his immediate right (right next to him) was one of the main pricks accused of the cover up during Steve's trial?

    I really do want some other facts to come up that were not highlighted in the documentary (or anywhere I can find online) to make me doubt the innocence of these two. Currently I find it impossible to understand how they are both in prison for this murder.
  • Youthist 28 Dec 2015 23:47:28 13,624 posts
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    https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/hacker-group-anonymous-helps-making-192856817.html
  • The-Bodybuilder 29 Dec 2015 00:10:14 17,540 posts
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    That would be interesting to know the information between those two crooked cops.
    I mean seriously, that one cop that identified the car whilst on the call? Dafuq is that about?
  • XRoyalOnieX 29 Dec 2015 07:27:11 83 posts
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    Watched a little didn't know what to think really I couldn't continue found it droning on was a bit to boring for me to be honest if he never did it what a woundehaa very sad to say the least
  • richarddavies 29 Dec 2015 08:11:20 6,608 posts
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    I started yesterday and managed 3 episodes. Enjoying it up to yet. Feel like I can't form a full opinion until I've seen it all though. Everytime I've watched an episode it's revealed a new piece of information which has changed my mind about who the biggest cunt in all of it was.
  • wobbly_Bob 29 Dec 2015 08:25:38 4,879 posts
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    Got manflu at the monent so just vegitated on the sofa and binged watched 8 episodes in a row. I stayed up late to watch the last one. Its very gripping. What a story.
  • Youthist 29 Dec 2015 09:55:25 13,624 posts
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    XRoyalOnieX wrote:
    Watched a little didn't know what to think really I couldn't continue found it droning on was a bit to boring for me to be honest if he never did it what a woundehaa very sad to say the least
    Great insight
  • wobbly_Bob 29 Dec 2015 14:00:04 4,879 posts
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    The day after watching and my head is still reeling. Just what the fucking fuck! How are those guys in prison and how is it those cops are walking free.

    Thinking about it today i wouldn't be surprised if the dead woman's brother had done it or even if the cops had a actually murdered her themselves. I think the latter isn't very likely but i most certainly wouldn't rule it out!

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