Page 299 • UK General Election 2017: Scumbags vs. Clowns • Non-Gaming • News and Politics • Eurogamer.net

FWB 29 Jun 2017 21:26:23 56,369 posts
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I disliked him prior to the election. Campaign started to win me over. Never really happy with him, but thought he'd be better than the Tories. Voted Labour cos my MP voted against A50 and LDs stood no chance in my area. I campaigned for LDs elsewhere and am a party member - have been for a few years.

I was an idiot for voting for Labour. First and last time.

Edited by FWB at 21:27:59 29-06-2017

chopsen 29 Jun 2017 21:28:09 21,958 posts
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Idiot

nickthegun 29 Jun 2017 21:29:46 87,711 posts
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Thats kind of where Im at with him. His campaign went some way making me believe he could be a credible contender but I've never been under any illusion where his opinions on the EU lay.

nickthegun 29 Jun 2017 21:30:06 87,711 posts
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But I didnt vote labour because fuck that.

FWB 29 Jun 2017 21:32:06 56,369 posts
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I just thought he'd be willing to listen to the centralists more now and moderate the exit. I've accepted it's got to happen to a certain degree. Even Clegg says it can only be overturned with another referendum.

Edited by FWB at 21:32:37 29-06-2017

simpleexplodingmaybe 29 Jun 2017 21:33:21 19,992 posts
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My local MP was a Labour Leave campaigner

I didn't believe him when he said being on the same side as Johnson, Gove and Farage would be good for a run down north eastern constituency and I don't believe Corbyn when he says it'll be good for a run down island nation.

chopsen 29 Jun 2017 21:36:08 21,958 posts
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So you thought a consistently principled and often contrarian politician with many years of form would totally change his colours because you had a feeling.

FWB 29 Jun 2017 21:40:11 56,369 posts
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I didn't know that he'd be smiting his MPs the way he did today. Okay, there were clues in the A50 vote, but thought perhaps that'd be limited and all his banging on about a fair society applied to politics too. Oh well.

Accepted he was pro-Brexit, but to what degree was not clear. In fact he was strongly suggesting that single market would be high on the agenda.

chopsen 29 Jun 2017 21:43:25 21,958 posts
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Well I'm sure you're not alone, fwiw. That actually makes it worse though.

simpleexplodingmaybe 29 Jun 2017 21:44:58 19,992 posts
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There were speeches and articles about how much he hated the EU taken down from his website as he became leader and was forced to compromise. I guess now he thinks he can win and change the rules of internal party democracy to favour his side he doesn't need to compromise anymore and his Brexit tendency can show through.

To be fair to him, it is the same Eurosceptic position that all of Labour campaigned for in 1983 and Corbyn hasn't changed any of his views since then. You don't win Times Eurosceptic of the Year by being flexible afterall.

FWB 29 Jun 2017 21:45:18 56,369 posts
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If my LD candidate had ever stood a chance, I wouldn't have voted Labour. Largely driven by ensuring the Tories didn't get in, but that doesn't stop me feeling shit about today.

FWB 29 Jun 2017 21:47:52 56,369 posts
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simpleexplodingmaybe wrote:
There were speeches and articles about how much he hated the EU taken down from his website as he became leader and was forced to compromise. I guess now he thinks he can win and change the rules of internal party democracy to favour his side he doesn't need to compromise anymore and his Brexit tendency can show through.

To be fair to him, it is the same Eurosceptic position that all of Labour campaigned for in 1983 and Corbyn hasn't changed any of his views since then. You don't win Times Eurosceptic of the Year by being flexible afterall.

Aye, but there were suggestions of compromise: He didn't speak of a hard-Brexit. He hinted at staying part of a number of institutions. He backed down on Trident. He stated, when challenged on why the manifesto when counter to some of his ideas, that he wasn't a tyrant and it was a consensus. I guess, as you say, it's going to his head now and he feels he can do what he wants.

nickthegun 29 Jun 2017 21:55:19 87,711 posts
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Our constituency was annoying. When Dave fucked off, the Lib Dems actually ran the conservatives comparatively close (they had no real chance of winning, but its close enough to give them pause) when choosing his replacement, with Labour a very distant third.

At the election the alternative vote was pretty much split in half so neither party got anywhere near them and they romped it.

simpleexplodingmaybe 29 Jun 2017 21:55:25 19,992 posts
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I feel like a lot of his compromises were done with him winking "not really" on the sly to all his old chums like Livingstone and Galloway

nickthegun 29 Jun 2017 21:59:47 87,711 posts
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One thing I have to give Corbyn is that one of the reasons Ive never been able to vote labour is that they have always felt like a party full of people who werent posh enough to become tory MPs.

At least with oh, jeremy corbyn you have someone who seems to, for better or worse, give a fuck.

Deleted user 29 June 2017 22:00:00

Labour were very clear on their stance before the election. It would be ridiculous to change their mind now.

FWB 29 Jun 2017 22:02:02 56,369 posts
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On Brexit they weren't. Leaving, yes, but the rest was mumbled.

nickthegun 29 Jun 2017 22:03:30 87,711 posts
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The basic problem is that one of the reasons labours vote increased was the 'mission accomplished' vote of people fleeing UKIP.

Leave voters are such a huge portion of their support, they just couldnt.

FWB 29 Jun 2017 22:04:41 56,369 posts
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Oh I know why, but they also waffled to gain Remain votes. Nothing is clear.

simpleexplodingmaybe 29 Jun 2017 22:09:40 19,992 posts
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Yeah Labour's Brexit position was different every time I saw someone speak. Each politician had a different interpretation but it also changed depending on who they were speaking to.

Stephen Bush called it the 0% strategy at the start of the campaign since if you were a leaver you'd support a fully leave party and likely a remainer would support a remain/soft as possible party, a party with no clear position in theory shouldn't attract anyone. In the end everyone decided to only hear what they wanted to and it turned into a position which appeal to both sides instead of repelling them.

Now, however, they finally have to decide what kind of party they want to be, and it turns out to be the kind where you can be fired for not being Brexity enough.

ResidentKnievel 29 Jun 2017 22:13:00 7,679 posts
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FWB wrote:
If my LD candidate had ever stood a chance, I wouldn't have voted Labour. Largely driven by ensuring the Tories didn't get in, but that doesn't stop me feeling shit about today.

^
Pretty much this

Brexit will irreparably damage the UK, shame the Lib Dem candidate had no chance in my constituency.

chopsen 29 Jun 2017 22:15:44 21,958 posts
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You do realise that the reason some doesn't "stand a chance" is because people don't vote for them yes?

FWB 29 Jun 2017 22:18:21 56,369 posts
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Have never stood a chance in where I voted. Even during their peak.

Now if I had been in my constituency that I was in in 2015, I'd have voted LD. They still got cleaned out this year, but in 2010 it was a three way, so there was some chance.

Dougs 29 Jun 2017 22:20:51 100,414 posts
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Their position seemed to be to rely on voters not understanding that their stance on FoM was incompatible with staying in the single market. This fudge of 'access to' is meaningless.

I don't really understand it, unless the strategy is to maintain the position, see it through and how badly it will fuck us all and then win the next election possibly under someone like Starmer. Quite what they will do with a failing economy though is another matter.

FWB 29 Jun 2017 22:25:35 56,369 posts
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Well there was some fudging of FoM by them. But I also think Brexit took a backseat to people wanting to bloody the Tories.

nickthegun 29 Jun 2017 22:26:52 87,711 posts
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Its quite funny, really. They were in charge when the financial crisis hit and its looking like they may be in charge just as the worst of brexit is starting to kick in, probably rendering them unelectable again because people will blame them for it again.

simpleexplodingmaybe 29 Jun 2017 22:28:37 19,992 posts
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Say: 'we want to protect jobs'
Do: 'end free movement to appease racists'
Think: 'this is what I wanted all along, take that capitalism'

You are Jeremy Corbyn.

chopsen 29 Jun 2017 22:33:10 21,958 posts
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Dougs wrote:
Their position seemed to be to rely on voters not understanding that their stance on FoM was incompatible with staying in the single market. This fudge of 'access to' is meaningless.

I don't really understand it, unless the strategy is to maintain the position, see it through and how badly it will fuck us all and then win the next election possibly under someone like Starmer. Quite what they will do with a failing economy though is another matter.

Some tories have that stance too though. This was practically Dan Hannan's entire spiel.

And I don't think there *is* a strategy. It's all about telling people what they want to hear to secure votes. Actually do something that is in the long term interest of the country?

chopsen 29 Jun 2017 22:34:02 21,958 posts
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@simpleexplodingmaybe

I keep saying this but it's all about promising X, delivering Y, saying it's Z which is what you were after all along.

DocDawg 29 Jun 2017 22:35:10 185 posts
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What the fuck is wrong with Corbyn? Sacking people who voted for the queens amendment to stay in the single market. We are well and truly fucked. He legit is for brexit at this point, so nothing will soften Tories brexit stance. God good. And reading about all these constant brutal hate crimes happening, and the brexit sword has yet to drop.

How in gods name can Corbyn not see brexit is a massive fucking mistake? His chief strategist, Seamnus Milne, is quite a left wing anti EU fanatic. I just didn't think he was this narrow minded.

Edited by DocDawg at 22:37:17 29-06-2017

UK General Election 2017: Scumbags vs. Clowns • Page 299