Anthem - New Bioware IP Page 24

  • Graxlar_v3 5 Feb 2019 12:48:33 6,870 posts
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    Who said they don't care about the FF14 story... i am ready to fight them.
  • Ror 5 Feb 2019 12:51:25 18,562 posts
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    Honestly, I'm not expecting it to have an amazing story - partly because they have pivoted from story/character-focused single player games for a multiplayer shooter - but I'm hoping the initial campaign is at least engaging. I don't think that's too much to ask for, given their past.


    H1ggyLTD wrote:
    Destiny's story problem was that the story was rubbish, as you'd expect given the turmoil it experienced.
    Aye, this. Bungie very clearly wanted the story/lore/worldbuilding to have a lot of weight. They just fucked it up quite badly. The fact that fans like Byf can still pull out some interesting threads is testament to the work Joe Staten and his writing team put into that side of things (before the higher-ups chopped it up and sewed it back together wrong).

    Yes I'm quoting Metalocalypse
  • SolidSCB 5 Feb 2019 13:00:08 11,201 posts
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    I don't.

    Well it's actually not because I don't like it, that's not the point I was making. I love story driven games, I love a lot of Bioware's stuff.

    But that's not the reason I want to play this type of game. My primary focus, and the focus of the people they are going to be relying on to keep this game alive, is on the content. The gear, the progression, the endgame. Long after the story has been exhausted and forgotten about, that's the bread and butter for the player.

    In my case it's a choice, and was especially so with FFXIV. Do I want to sit and watch hours and hours of cutscenes, wade through page after page after page of text? Or do I want to spend that time getting through to the bit of the game I actually want to play? The endgame and the grind towards the best stuff?

    It's less important with stuff like Destiny, because the cutscenes etc are fleeting and kept to a minimum. But when a DLC drops for Destiny for instance, the majority of the many people I have played with will see the story portion of that new content as a distraction to be plowed through. Before the primary function, the grind towards the new Raid/piece of endgame content can be started on.

    It's the nature of this type of game. That's not me saying 'everyone just skips the cutscenes anyway'.
  • Ror 5 Feb 2019 13:24:47 18,562 posts
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    That's absolutely fair. But do you think it's possible that the type of player you are means you will gravitate towards players with the same interest, and thus skew your perception of the audience a bit?

    I'm not saying you're wrong - I daresay there are more people that care about the endgame gear grind than story, but enough people care about that stuff that it should be a focus (one of many - this isn't a zero sum game). Entire communities spring up around this stuff, even in these types of game: Byf has made a living out of discovering and presenting Destiny lore in a more digestible way; WoW novels have already been mentioned; Square Enix have put out two enormous lore books (I have them, they're great!), and now have a collection of short stories on the way.

    A decent number of people clearly care about this stuff, and they should be catered to. It should be workable to have a decent campaign, interesting world and good endgame. Destiny has done all of those (maybe not at the same time!). FFXIV certainly has.
  • THFourteen 5 Feb 2019 13:36:51 52,213 posts
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    Also there is a scarcity of single player fps games thesedays. So those of us who like campaigns often have to buy the multiplayer games for the campaign

    I mean nobody is going to buy Exodus now.

    Edited by THFourteen at 13:37:17 05-02-2019
  • Frogofdoom 5 Feb 2019 13:53:04 13,433 posts
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    They will as soon as they see the reviews.
  • SolidSCB 5 Feb 2019 14:00:23 11,201 posts
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    Ror wrote:
    That's absolutely fair. But do you think it's possible that the type of player you are means you will gravitate towards players with the same interest, and thus skew your perception of the audience a bit?

    I'm not saying you're wrong - I daresay there are more people that care about the endgame gear grind than story, but enough people care about that stuff that it should be a focus (one of many - this isn't a zero sum game). Entire communities spring up around this stuff, even in these types of game: Byf has made a living out of discovering and presenting Destiny lore in a more digestible way; WoW novels have already been mentioned; Square Enix have put out two enormous lore books (I have them, they're great!), and now have a collection of short stories on the way.

    A decent number of people clearly care about this stuff, and they should be catered to. It should be workable to have a decent campaign, interesting world and good endgame. Destiny has done all of those (maybe not at the same time!). FFXIV certainly has.
    To an extent you have a point. Of course I'm going to end up in my 'niche' and play alongside the like minded. But again, I've played in many, many different parties, raid groups etc that haven't been cherry-picked off my list that have the same typical motivations in these games.

    I'm not saying there isn't an audience there to cater to, but I don't feel like it is the majority at all. My point (which has become diluted in anecdotes) is that I don't feel as though it's a wise use of resources and focus to put all this branching dialogue, unique story mumbo-jumbo into a game where most long-term players are just going to want to grind for gear.
  • Bichii 5 Feb 2019 14:06:58 1,809 posts
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    Hell yes I'm buying exodus. Oh no we have to install a new launcher and it's not in my precious steam launcher that charges games 30%.
  • Graxlar_v3 5 Feb 2019 14:31:18 6,870 posts
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    Ror wrote:

    A decent number of people clearly care about this stuff, and they should be catered to. It should be workable to have a decent campaign, interesting world and good endgame. Destiny has done all of those (maybe not at the same time!). FFXIV certainly has.
    FF14 is getting a new game + mode, people care about the story in that game.
  • Ror 5 Feb 2019 14:40:56 18,562 posts
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    SolidSCB wrote:
    To an extent you have a point. Of course I'm going to end up in my 'niche' and play alongside the like minded. But again, I've played in many, many different parties, raid groups etc that haven't been cherry-picked off my list that have the same typical motivations in these games.

    I'm not saying there isn't an audience there to cater to, but I don't feel like it is the majority at all. My point (which has become diluted in anecdotes) is that I don't feel as though it's a wise use of resources and focus to put all this branching dialogue, unique story mumbo-jumbo into a game where most long-term players are just going to want to grind for gear.
    Again, I tend to agree that the majority will care more about long-term engagement, thus making that element 'more important'. But something being 'less important' doesn't equate to unimportant - as before, it's not a zero sum game. They can accommodate both, especially in a field like game development which is multidisciplinary.

    Additionally, story stuff can become another source of revenue, if they decide to take the transmedia approach. With both Mass Effect and Dragon Age, they also made money on novels, comic books, lore books, art books, figurines and other merchandise. I imagine they'll do the same here, and in order to do so, they have to have some kind of foundation to build on.

    All of this can be important without being the most important element.
  • SolidSCB 5 Feb 2019 15:19:16 11,201 posts
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    It is not unimportant, but I can't help but feel like they've just tried to barge one of their games into the genre and forgotten what makes them important long-term.

    They can only capitalise on all that stuff if the game itself does the business though. Stuff like Final Fantasy can get by on reputation and has time to get things right based on 13 highly successful iterations. Let us not forget that XIV got a second bite at the cherry after completely bollocksing the first attempt, and without that second chance there would have been very little scope for the additional lore and all that stuff you and some of the others enjoy.
  • Frogofdoom 5 Feb 2019 16:34:10 13,433 posts
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    Whilst on the subject of story, I have read that the missions in the demo aren't part of the main story and we're side missions. Another unusual decision!
  • Dombat 5 Feb 2019 17:04:22 1,585 posts
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    @Ror good points made.

    I think if the endgame turns out to be poorly fleshed out at this stage, that is a result of EA forcing the game out this financial year and not because Bioware have been overly focused on other aspects of the game. Obviously that's me speculating, but the endgame doesn't need to be at the expense of the story content, as you say.

    While I'm sceptical on a personal level about the quality of the story Anthem will deliver, I won't deny there are a lot of Bioware fans and gamers in general who are hoping for at least some sort of meaningful campaign, even if a majority of looter shooter players are indifferent to it.

    I suspect Bioware will need to win over players in both groups for the game to be successful.

    Edited by Dombat at 17:12:02 05-02-2019
  • Ror 5 Feb 2019 18:00:07 18,562 posts
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    @Dombat I think there might be an issue of bandwidth, to be honest. How big did Bungie get? 700-odd? And they had Vicarious Visions and High Moon working on content for the game as well. Admittedly, I don't know how many are at Bioware Edmonton (or even if EA have other studios poised to offer support, admittedly), but I wouldn't have thought they are as gargantuan as that. I have a feeling there'll be some content droughts coming down the pipe, which certainly won't help with keeping players engaged in the long term. Guess we'll have to wait and see on that front.

    SolidSCB wrote:
    It is not unimportant, but I can't help but feel like they've just tried to barge one of their games into the genre and forgotten what makes them important long-term.

    They can only capitalise on all that stuff if the game itself does the business though. Stuff like Final Fantasy can get by on reputation and has time to get things right based on 13 highly successful iterations. Let us not forget that XIV got a second bite at the cherry after completely bollocksing the first attempt, and without that second chance there would have been very little scope for the additional lore and all that stuff you and some of the others enjoy.
    That's an absolutely fair thing to be concerned about. I just also think it's fair for someone to be hoping for a reasonable campaign for Bioware's entry into a genre that, typically, has a story of some kind. The game's out in ten days, so I guess we'll know all when reviews drop.

    XIV did, thankfully, get a second bite at the cherry. 1.0 was borderline broken, but they were also trying to remake FFXI in a post-WoW, GCD world. Interestingly, the setting and all its lore are one of the things they did keep. Which, ok, seems like a flippant comment on the face of it - it would probably have taken too long to create a whole new setting - but it also suggests that the narrative team at SE highly valued it. You can see this any time you see Koji Fox talk about lore stuff. And it has clearly found a passionate audience.

    Frogofdoom wrote:
    Whilst on the subject of story, I have read that the missions in the demo aren't part of the main story and we're side missions. Another unusual decision!
    I guess they didn't want to spoil anything, but yeah, doesn't seem to have worked out in their favour :)
  • Dirtbox 6 Feb 2019 01:57:06 91,141 posts
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    Was it 6 months before enough bugs were fixed on Battlefield 4 before it became playable?

    I'm going to go on record and say this will beat that for game breaking bullshit for a few months more.
  • Huggybear 6 Feb 2019 06:58:42 1,607 posts
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    @Dirtbox

    Tbh the biggest issue in BF4 was the net code, and this is a PvE-only game.

    But yeah, I wouldn't get this at launch, especially since it'll probably be available for half the price in a few weeks if it fails to sell at launch like Bf5 did.
  • Bichii 6 Feb 2019 07:31:45 1,809 posts
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    Well as it was pretty much 30 at shopto I'm keeping my order and I'm sure I'll enjoy myself for a month before the real game is released at the end of march.
  • THFourteen 6 Feb 2019 10:51:49 52,213 posts
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    Think i might play this anyway.

    Maybe playing from the start will make it a better game rather than being throw in at the middle of the story.
  • One_Vurfed_Gwrx 6 Feb 2019 20:30:46 3,511 posts
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    Dombat wrote:
    Some online games are more story driven than others. FFXIV is a MMO with a greater focus on story than most in the genre, so it would be reasonable for more of its players to feel engaged in it (or want to be invested in it).

    I think Bioware get too much credit for their dialogue and storytelling based on (increasing distant) past games. Many lead writers have left Bioware over the years. They are basically now just studios for AAA EA action games.

    I wouldn't get my hopes up about the depth and quality of storytelling with this game.
    Off topic but I have always been curious if it was worth getting either FFXI or XIV when cheap and trying to get story done as quickly as possible to minimise monthly costs (as I really don't care for full on MMO but hear good things about tue stories). I hear XI is more soloable these days too.
  • [maven] 7 Feb 2019 11:58:03 5,620 posts
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    @One_Vurfed_Gwrx That's what I do with FFXIV near the end of every expansion, and I think that's very fair (and works surprisingly well on console, too). Just look out for a sale / complete edition (which will include a free month usually), and play until you're a) through the parts you find interesting, or b) sick of it.

    Edited by [maven] at 11:58:42 07-02-2019
  • Ror 7 Feb 2019 12:11:39 18,562 posts
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    @One_Vurfed_Gwrx FFXIV is free up to level 35. Do that, then sub for a month to finish up.

    I would say look up preferred worlds to get the Road to 60 buff (gives you double XP, iirc) - but I'm not entirely sure you get that on a trial account..?

    Also, the 2.0 (A Realm Reborn) story is pretty good, but it really picks up in the 2.x quests that released between that and Heavensward.

    But yeah, if you just want to see what it's like, play the trial and see how you go.
  • Graxlar_v3 7 Feb 2019 17:21:18 6,870 posts
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    Ror wrote:
    @One_Vurfed_Gwrx FFXIV is free up to level 35. Do that, then sub for a month to finish up.

    I would say look up preferred worlds to get the Road to 60 buff (gives you double XP, iirc) - but I'm not entirely sure you get that on a trial account..?

    Also, the 2.0 (A Realm Reborn) story is pretty good, but it really picks up in the 2.x quests that released between that and Heavensward.

    But yeah, if you just want to see what it's like, play the trial and see how you go.
    FF14 is free on twitch prime right now.

    And if anyone is looking to play it, I will happily run them through dungeons etc.
  • jack5255 7 Feb 2019 22:19:47 773 posts
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    https://youtu.be/fGBAwOTgFw8

    Bit more footage for anyone interested

    Small roadmap breakdown as well on the same channel
  • Frogofdoom 10 Feb 2019 13:10:37 13,433 posts
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    Yeah, it will be nice to see how much things have smoothed out since the demo. I have it coming on 2 systems though and will trade on the Xbox one version for a profit and play on pc with the free version that came with my graphics card. Signs are that a lot of the issues are fixed but you never know.
  • Frogofdoom 10 Feb 2019 13:27:22 13,433 posts
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    Not horrific amounts, got a 2060, my pc hadn't been touched for years before so gave it a spruce up.
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