The "well, that's a bit wrong now, when you really think about it" film thread Page 5

  • anephric 16 Aug 2018 21:08:36 5,274 posts
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    There's a famous Louis Malle film (who also directed the pervfest already-mentioned Pretty Baby) called Murmur of the Heart, which is basically about a young boy that fucks his mum. It's all presented as incredibly natural and romantic and coming (fnarr) of age and ahhh la Francais, l'amour! It's very well regarded to this day

    Oh, our continental cousins and their mumfuckery.
  • JamboWayOh 16 Aug 2018 21:38:00 25,236 posts
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    David_Richardson wrote:
    Can somebody put all of these films in a convenient list so I know which of my old DVDs I need to digitally back up and catalogue by filth rating?
  • simpleexplodingmaybe 18 Aug 2018 01:05:03 19,992 posts
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    Has anybody mentioned Alan Bennett's History Boys yet?

    That's not even that old but you'd get so many think pieces and so much social media outrage nowadays
  • Deleted user 18 August 2018 09:44:41
    anephric wrote:
    There's a famous Louis Malle film (who also directed the pervfest already-mentioned Pretty Baby) called Murmur of the Heart, which is basically about a young boy that fucks his mum. It's all presented as incredibly natural and romantic and coming (fnarr) of age and ahhh la Francais, l'amour! It's very well regarded to this day

    Oh, our continental cousins and their mumfuckery.
    To be fair it is not just the continentals, David O'Russell made a film called Spank the Monkey about a dubious relationship between mother and son.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 18 Aug 2018 12:21:12 23,013 posts
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    Not forgetting of course Les Cousins Dangereux.
  • anephric 18 Aug 2018 12:49:49 5,274 posts
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    Spank the Monkey is deliberately transgressive though and the whole tone is dark. You'd have to watch Murmur of the Heart, it's like a sunsoaked paean to the wistful days when it was a French mother's duty to make her son a man.
  • Deleted user 18 August 2018 13:28:26
    @anephric that is a fair point, it is not unintentionally dodgy like many of the films mentioned.
  • DakeyrasUK 30 Aug 2018 22:22:35 5,311 posts
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    Just watched Bill and Ted's excellent adventure. There's a part where they hug after Ted isn't dead and saves Bill in medieval England. After they part and call each other fags.

    My wife and I looked at each other and sighed, I muttered well that bit hasn't aged well...
  • anephric 30 Aug 2018 23:31:04 5,274 posts
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    They were still pulling that shit with the Bill and Ted live show at Universal Halloween until a few years ago. Superman being a 'fag' and coming on to Bill and Ted etc.

    https://www.vice.com/amp/en_us/article/av4z45/the-bill-and-ted-show-at-universal-studios-is-super-homophobic-and-also-racist-and-terrible

    Edited by anephric at 23:32:16 30-08-2018
  • ooombasa 31 Aug 2018 03:43:50 110 posts
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    Watched The Breakfast Club on Now TV and Ace Ventura on Netflix recently and... Oh dear.

    First off, John threatens Claire with rape but not to worry it's just bants! Then, when hiding under the desk from the teacher John outright sexually assaults Claire by sticking his head in-between her legs. The response of which is he's a "boys will be boys" kind of nuisance. And then there's the constant sexually abusive language he throws at Claire throughout the film... And yet he still gets the girl in the end? Talk about the wrong message to send out, for both boys (treat them mean) and girls (it's ok to be treated like a dog).

    And the less said about the transphobic messaging of Ace Ventura the better. Yikes did that not age well.

    Edited by ooombasa at 03:59:37 31-08-2018
  • ooombasa 31 Aug 2018 03:46:35 110 posts
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    DakeyrasUK wrote:
    Just watched Bill and Ted's excellent adventure. There's a part where they hug after Ted isn't dead and saves Bill in medieval England. After they part and call each other fags.

    My wife and I looked at each other and sighed, I muttered well that bit hasn't aged well...
    Yeah, that word is thrown out so casually in The Breakfast Club as well. Surprising how much it can jolt you. Like, you know it's an 80's film but to see it be used so casually and matter of fact still surprises you.
  • JYM60 1 Sep 2018 13:40:11 19,085 posts
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    Wtf. Comedies still make fun of gays and trans all the time. I don't think that is at all an 80s or 90s thing!
  • You-can-call-me-kal 1 Sep 2018 14:09:36 23,013 posts
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    I feel like you’ve slightly missed the point in the Breakfast Club. He’s a bully because he’s a victim of bullying, and it’s only once he’s shown his vulnerability that he gets the girl. That still works as a message today

    It’s aged pretty well I think. Kids still behave that way. It’s not endorsing or glamorising it. The only thing that’s really dated is the way Ally Sheedy’s character only gets accepted once she confirms to social norms and standards of beauty.
  • ooombasa 1 Sep 2018 15:19:13 110 posts
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    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    I feel like you’ve slightly missed the point in the Breakfast Club. He’s a bully because he’s a victim of bullying, and it’s only once he’s shown his vulnerability that he gets the girl. That still works as a message today

    It’s aged pretty well I think. Kids still behave that way. It’s not endorsing or glamorising it. The only thing that’s really dated is the way Ally Sheedy’s character only gets accepted once she confirms to social norms and standards of beauty.
    There is no missing the point because the guy who sexually assaults and abuses the girl into breaking down several times throughout the film ends up getting the same girl in the end. And no, getting the girl after sexually assaulting her is not a message that works. Molly Ringwald who played as Claire revisited the film with her daughter and had to come to the same uncomfortable truth. She also spoke how at the time she and her mother had to fight against certain things the writer / director wanted to do. The sexual assault scene was something she and her mother was very uncomfortable with but ultimately did not win against replacing it.

    Edited by ooombasa at 15:22:39 01-09-2018
  • ooombasa 1 Sep 2018 15:29:21 110 posts
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    JYM60 wrote:
    Wtf. Comedies still make fun of gays and trans all the time. I don't think that is at all an 80s or 90s thing!
    No one is saying it still isn't the case, they've just changed the language. It was the F word that was thrown around so casually and now it has been replaced with "gay" in a derogatory sense.

    I know certain American TV sitcoms still did the whole "so gay" up until recently, including the most popular one The Big Bang Theory.

    It's more a case of how blatant it used to be. The F word was used like it was soon going out of fashion. But make no mistake there is still far to go when it comes to this.
  • ooombasa 1 Sep 2018 15:41:44 110 posts
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    Molly Ringwald said it best

    "It’s hard for me to understand how John Hughes was able to write with so much sensitivity, and also have such a glaring blind spot."
    His three most famous films all have glaring blind spots when it comes to the portrayal and treatment of women despite the strides he also took to put them front and center.

    For Sixteen Candles he had an incredibly WTF moment in the script before Molly's mother told him to change it.

    In “Sixteen Candles,” a character alternately called the Geek and Farmer Ted makes a bet with friends that he can score with my character, Samantha; by way of proof, he says, he will secure her underwear. Later in the film, after Samantha agrees to help the Geek by loaning her underwear to him, she has a heartwarming scene with her father.

    It originally ended with the father asking, “Sam, what the hell happened to your underpants?” My mom objected. “Why would a father know what happened to his daughter’s underwear?” she asked. John squirmed uncomfortably. He didn’t mean it that way, he said—it was just a joke, a punch line. “But it’s not funny,” my mother said. “It’s creepy.” The line was changed to “Just remember, Sam, you wear the pants in the family.”
    And that's not the only instance of creepiness in his films.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 1 Sep 2018 15:53:00 23,013 posts
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    ooombasa wrote:
    JYM60 wrote:
    Wtf. Comedies still make fun of gays and trans all the time. I don't think that is at all an 80s or 90s thing!
    No one is saying it still isn't the case, they've just changed the language. It was the F word that was thrown around so casually and now it has been replaced with "gay" in a derogatory sense.

    I know certain American TV sitcoms still did the whole "so gay" up until recently, including the most popular one The Big Bang Theory.

    It's more a case of how blatant it used to be. The F word was used like it was soon going out of fashion. But make no mistake there is still far to go when it comes to this.
    Is still the F word. Superbad they call Fogel ‘Fagal’ throughout the film.
  • RGeefe 1 Sep 2018 18:13:07 2,409 posts
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    it took me a good few minutes to realise the "f word" was not fuck. I didn't even realise it was a word people still used, even Americans. never heard it used in England.
  • monkman76 1 Sep 2018 18:16:14 18,987 posts
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    Well everyone vapes these days don't they.
  • DakeyrasUK 1 Sep 2018 21:58:28 5,311 posts
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    JYM60 wrote:
    Wtf. Comedies still make fun of gays and trans all the time. I don't think that is at all an 80s or 90s thing!
    Maybe not in America, but in my experience the last 10-15 years there has been a large swing away from the use of fag/gay as derogatory slur for people who aren't being homosexual but just something - I'm not sure what because people use it and when called out they so oh no, I'm not using it as a derogatory word for homosexuals... As if it would be ok to use the n word to your white mate in the presence of black people and expect them to be OK with it!

    One of things I like most about being a teacher is seeing how the youth attitude to lgbt issues is vastly more accepting than it was 20 years ago when I was in education being guilty of using the word gay as described above.
  • JYM60 3 Sep 2018 10:54:45 19,085 posts
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    I watched the movie Hatchet last night and someone was called a queer as a derogatory term.

    I guess that is a bit over 10 years old though. But I think stuff like that is still pretty commonplace in American movies.

    Should probably note that this movie is pretty much derogatory remarks the whole way through, from strippers being slandered, to an Asian man being referred to as Jackie Chan.

    Edited by JYM60 at 10:58:03 03-09-2018
  • Tonka 3 Sep 2018 11:46:08 31,979 posts
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    In Can't Hardly Wait (which is superb by the way) the Jock is humiliated infront of an entire house party by his ex and then someone shouts F*g at him as the cherry on top.

    I reacted to it so I guess using different derogatory terms for homosexuals as insults has diminished. I wasn't aware that it's now been elevated to (insert lett)-word status though.
  • Decks 3 Sep 2018 11:51:24 31,013 posts
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    Fag (I'm not saying fucking f word) has kind of taken a different meaning in America, it's not necessarily a homophobic slur. Louis CK does a bit on it. God rest him.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 3 Sep 2018 12:10:32 23,013 posts
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    I watched Heathers over the weekend. It's an amazing film and has aged incredibly well (if anything it's got better with age), but in a world where school shootings are now a regular occurrence, I doubt whether it's a film that would be made today. Certainly the tone of it would be very different.

    By the by seeing as we were talking about Breakfast Club, it's almost the yang to the film's ying. They'd make an excellent double bill. Heathers is very knowingly subverting John Hughes in general.
  • challenge_hanukkah 3 Sep 2018 12:13:58 14,394 posts
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    Decks wrote:
    Fag (I'm not saying fucking f word) has kind of taken a different meaning in America, it's not necessarily a homophobic slur. Louis CK does a bit on it. God rest him.
    Probably not the best go to guy for what is or isn't appropriate.

    Edited by challenge_hanukkah at 12:19:42 03-09-2018
  • nickthegun 3 Sep 2018 12:15:00 87,711 posts
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    I think that's pretty much why the TV remake was canned. The network got very cold feet about the content.
  • BreadBinLidHero 3 Sep 2018 12:18:04 10,801 posts
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    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    I watched Heathers over the weekend. It's an amazing film and has aged incredibly well (if anything it's got better with age), but in a world where school shootings are now a regular occurrence, I doubt whether it's a film that would be made today. Certainly the tone of it would be very different.

    By the by seeing as we were talking about Breakfast Club, it's almost the yang to the film's ying. They'd make an excellent double bill. Heathers is very knowingly subverting John Hughes in general.
    One of my all-time favourites, and is as black as Dr. Strangelove or Four Lions. If only they had they done the original ending.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 3 Sep 2018 12:19:29 23,013 posts
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    That would be a good triple bill.

    I also think Heathers, Repo Man and They Live would make an awesome triple bill.
  • fontgeeksogood 3 Sep 2018 12:23:33 12,913 posts
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    I never understood why the 25 year old dude was in the Breakfast Club with a load of teenagers
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