Devil May Cry 5 Page 2

  • nickthegun 25 Sep 2018 11:43:27 76,528 posts
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    JamboWayOh wrote:
    It's almost as if they've forgotten the clusterfuck that was Street Fighter 5.
    And that was after they crippled SFxT with the gems nonsense, culminating in no one buying MvC Infinity cuz, y'know, actions have consequences.

    Just to be clear, I do think the grind will likely be set as normal and the microtransactions are unlikely to have affected the balancing BUT I can absolutely see why people are worried and their concerns absolutely have merit.

    Personally, it's demoted the game from an insta-buy to a 'wait for the reviews' because as much as I love the series (DMC included) fuck grind inflation sky high.
  • JamboWayOh 25 Sep 2018 11:44:16 11,157 posts
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    Exactly, the whole point is not for the ease of the consumer it's to make money from a product you've already paid full price for. If you have MTs in a game from in its inception then it will have an obvious effect on its game progression.
  • Rhaegyr 25 Sep 2018 11:45:40 4,673 posts
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    It surprises me that no game 'journalists' ask this question - there were two separate articles regarding DMC5 on EG recently - one on the inclusion of MTX and one being an interview with the developer. At no point did they ask him why they couldn't be implemented as cheat codes or question their validity in general.

    If their inclusion is purely for 'time poor' players, surely codes would solve this?
  • Darth_Flibble 25 Sep 2018 11:46:26 3,289 posts
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    Gearskin wrote:
    I'm not "sticking up" for them. I'm ignoring them and think their inclusion here will be near invisible in the finished product.

    I remmeber when Dead Space 3 came out, years ago, and allowed players to use real money to modify their weapons. I remember the screaming about how the game would never dish out enough resources to make the modifications you would want, how the whole system would be built around forcing players to hand over real money.

    This sounds... Familiar.
    The game forced you to buy another scavenging droid for real money as you couldn't earn in game. I felt on hard mode it never gave enough resources for that mode but it would offer to sell you the shit
  • Load_2.0 25 Sep 2018 11:50:08 28,574 posts
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    Gearskin wrote:
    I'm not "sticking up" for them. I'm ignoring them and think their inclusion here will be near invisible in the finished product.
    They are going to be visible, every time you open the menu.
  • Gearskin 25 Sep 2018 11:50:54 3,201 posts
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    I finished that game twice, and once again in Coop, and I don't think I ever opened that menu. Hell, I don't even know where the option to buy resources is.

    And it ended up being my favourite game in the series.

    https://www.dualshockers.com/devil-may-cry-5-red-orbs-playing-normally

    Bookmark that, the party can get crazy in March when the numbers change.
  • Rhaegyr 25 Sep 2018 11:53:55 4,673 posts
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    @Gearskin

    Would you not prefer for the developer to provide them as cheat codes?
  • Gearskin 25 Sep 2018 11:57:16 3,201 posts
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    To be honest, I don't care either way. Because I wouldn't use them. End of the day it's Capcom's product, they can do whatever they like with it. If they genuinely make enough money out of selling Orbs to warrant any potential bad PR... I'd be surprised... But it'll make zero difference to me when the game comes out.
  • Blackmarsh63 25 Sep 2018 11:57:31 1,965 posts
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    @Rhaegyr Game director says "With giving people the ability to purchase Red Orbs, itís something we want to give people as an option. If they want to save time and just want to get all the stuff at once, those people can do that."

    Why would anyone want to pay extra to finish it quickly.

    Edited by Blackmarsh63 at 11:59:38 25-09-2018
  • Rhaegyr 25 Sep 2018 11:59:38 4,673 posts
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    Gearskin wrote:
    To be honest, I don't care either way. Because I wouldn't use them. End of the day it's Capcom's product, they can do whatever they like with it. If they genuinely make enough money out of selling Orbs to warrant any potential bad PR... I'd be surprised... But it'll make zero difference to me when the game comes out.
    You're a publishers wet dream.
  • Gearskin 25 Sep 2018 12:04:26 3,201 posts
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    Why? Because I won't pay them money for their Microtransactions?

    Surely their wet dream is actually me buying ALL the Microtransactions for both myself and Nick?
  • Darth_Flibble 25 Sep 2018 12:08:38 3,289 posts
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    Gamers who just accept this shit leads to stuff like NBA 2k where in 2k17, you had to grind money just for haircut or level up your skills. Maybe this game is not as bad but at one point the 2k games were not as bad.
  • Tuffty 25 Sep 2018 12:09:16 4,278 posts
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    Darth_Flibble wrote:
    Gearskin wrote:
    Microtransactions were in DMC4SE and I wouldn't say anybody noticed. It was the same game as DMC4 but with the feature added, I don't think it made any difference to the cost of moves etc.
    No one noticed because no one was really bothered about a cheap port to new consoles.
    While adding 3 new playable characters. So cheap right?

    You're not going to unlock every move on your first play through unless you replayed missions during it. Every game in the genre has it to encourage longevity. I think people that are wondering why fans would put up with MT is because the fans genuinely don't see it as an issue. They're used to replaying the fuck out of every mission, it's an accepted part of playing it.

    Like I said, if it costs an insane amount of red orbs to get even the basic moves like stinger or air hike then I'll have cause to be upset. But there's no reason to think that at this moment so the outrage seems a bit mad. Looking forward for all the angry YouTubers to question why gold orbs cost so much without doing the basic research. It's already happened. DMC doesn't have stats or gear or loot so the comparisons with NBA or Shadow of War are just wrong.

    Edited by Tuffty at 12:10:13 25-09-2018
  • Rhaegyr 25 Sep 2018 12:12:52 4,673 posts
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    Gearskin wrote:
    Why? Because I won't pay them money for their Microtransactions?

    Surely their wet dream is actually me buying ALL the Microtransactions for both myself and Nick?
    Because your acceptance of it leads to more widespread use. You and Tuffty are excusing something that now costs money (on top of the £50 game) that used to be a cheat code built into the game at no cost to the player.

    It's the thin end of the wedge (well, it used to be).
  • Gearskin 25 Sep 2018 12:15:55 3,201 posts
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    Guess we'll just reconvene in March 2019 then because there's little point arguing over something hypothetical.

    In closing, I fully expect DMC4SE to be the model for their implementation. And I fully expect the last two pages were a fantastic waste of our time.
  • Rhaegyr 25 Sep 2018 12:19:21 4,673 posts
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    Just answer me this - do you see any issue with the developers offering the combo/weapon upgrades as cheat codes in lieu of charging for them for 'time poor consumers'?
  • Gearskin 25 Sep 2018 12:23:38 3,201 posts
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    I don't. And it's kinda cheeky to apply real cost. But at the same time, like I said above, it's not something I choose to engage with. And I certainly wouldn't avoid playing this whole game on principle.

    I just won't engage with the MTs. Same as always.

    I'd actually be curious to know just how much revenue such things generate. Like you say, it's a £50 game already. They'll probably shop a few million copies. How many people actually engage with the MTs? Does anyone know?
  • Dombat 25 Sep 2018 12:47:04 1,491 posts
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    For me, it depends how much of a grind it is and how essential unlocking everything is to completing the game and enjoying it in the process.

    It was easy to say "fuck this game" out of principle when it's a game I'm not really interested in, like Shadow of War, but I do want to play this. I'd rather just avoid MTs than boycott the game outright.
  • Tuffty 25 Sep 2018 12:48:33 4,278 posts
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    @Gearskin I can only imagine it was successful enough in DMC4 SE to warrant including it here. It's not just for new players I've read a fair few accounts of expert players returning to the SE who just opted to buy all the moves right away because they were so used to having them. That's their decision.

    If Capcom say they're not including them then you won't see me shed a tear. I'm acknowledging they are there and that the cost of moves can change before it comes out, nothing would bum me out more. However I don't think that way because 1. past DMC games have had some "grind" to get everything, 2. current impressions are that red orbs rewards in DMC5 are more generous than ever and current items in the shop are easily affordable through regular play and 3. There is precedent for this as DMC4SE had microtransactions and Itsuno's last project, Dragons Dogma, also had microtransactions which people don't realise because it was also the biggest non issue.
  • Navi 25 Sep 2018 13:54:35 277 posts
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    I actually sold my copy of Dragons Dogma when I got to the bit when you could buy crystals. I was already finding it a bit of a grind, and that was enough to think 'sod it' and buy something else.

    As for DMC, it's just a matter of waiting for reviews and others to comment on the grind then pick it up if it's good a bit after release.
  • pacrifice 25 Sep 2018 14:26:33 4,589 posts
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    I'm a big devil may cry fan. 1 is a classic, 2 is a Trainwreck. 3 is my beloved, 4 was ok but 4se is my bread and butter as Vergil is at his finest.

    When 4se came, I didn't fancy completing the whole game again with Nero and Dante to get Vergil so just paid the £2 whatever unlock, orb farmed and got the moves back so quickly.
  • Decks Best Forumite, 2016 25 Sep 2018 14:38:33 17,866 posts
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    Yeah OK, calm down Rockefeller.
  • nickthegun 25 Sep 2018 14:40:42 76,528 posts
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    To be fair..... DMC4 is a something you can probably make a case for. That game is a fucking chore.
  • Rhaegyr 25 Sep 2018 14:45:04 4,673 posts
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    They should add an option to be able to skip cut-scenes by paying too for those time-poor players.
  • pacrifice 25 Sep 2018 14:47:07 4,589 posts
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    I'm not feeling devil may cry 5.

    For one, what immediately comes to mind when I see gameplay is how slow it is - 3se and 4se have turbo mode and it just makes so much more sense to have that speed as the default.... In a year's time if they release a 5se with turbo mode, 🙄

    I don't like that they've retained the ninja theory artstyle (yeah, I don't like the ninja theory dmc).

    I can't stand that music Devil Trigger. When I come across people saying how much they like it, I can't tell if they're being serious or sarcastic. Back when 4 was in development, https://youtu.be/x_0kKIOaVXc this is such an early build of the game but you can hear the battle music here, they obviously didn't use but I think something like this would be better suited. Plus, they also need to ensure there's ambient music when not in battle - like in 1 when you're going through the castle etc

    I don't like how their first reveal of dmc5 was Nero - we've seen him all over 4, we need Dante. Yes, they're now showing him but is this really a Dante dmc game or a Nero dmc game?

    But after playing as Virgil, Dante and Nero are so slow.

    Maybe they'll show some more gameplay and I'll be convinced that this is going to be good but so far, the art style, the music, the non-turbo gameplay, I'm not feeling confident about it.

    Edited by pacrifice at 14:49:30 25-09-2018
  • JamboWayOh 25 Sep 2018 14:57:52 11,157 posts
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    Tbh you were never going to pay for it until it came down to about unde a fiver.

    Edited by JamboWayOh at 21:45:25 25-09-2018
  • pacrifice 25 Sep 2018 15:11:01 4,589 posts
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    Right now, I wouldn't even pay a penny for this game and hey, I do sometimes buy games day 1! I've not officially signed up in the thread but I've not bought nowhere near as many games as I have done in previous years. Currently going through horizon, first playthrough, bought day 1. Still got Bloodborne and Witcher 3.
  • Load_2.0 25 Sep 2018 16:19:47 28,574 posts
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    JamboWayOh wrote:
    Tbh you were never going to pay for it until it came down to about an unde giver.
    "unde giver"

    I think that guy found Jambo's new address. He is showing him what happens to bad friends.

    If you are being raped or strangled mash the keyboard now!
  • captain-Snufkin 25 Sep 2018 16:25:25 764 posts
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    Gearskin wrote:
    To be honest, I don't care either way. Because I wouldn't use them. End of the day it's Capcom's product, they can do whatever they like with it. If they genuinely make enough money out of selling Orbs to warrant any potential bad PR... I'd be surprised... But it'll make zero difference to me when the game comes out.

    Except they'll have bound to screw up balance to get money, why else would they do it. There'll be some cheesy way they'll break immersion by telling you you can skip this and that every five minutes. It's thoroughly horrendous game design.
  • Gearskin 25 Sep 2018 16:28:45 3,201 posts
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    Or... it'll be like it was in DMC4SE. Which is none of that.
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