Following New Apple Stuff Page 14

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  • Phattso 23 Jun 2020 20:31:07 25,306 posts
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    fontgeeksogood wrote:
    Looking forward to the big announcement that iOS apps will work natively on the Macs (because refactoring for a totally new chipset will invariably have casualties)
    Not sure if serious? This was announced and demoed yesterday.

    Edited by Phattso at 20:31:41 23-06-2020
  • Fake_Blood 23 Jun 2020 20:48:53 10,377 posts
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    I donít want to sound like the old guy that needs his pc to run legacy software, but I do think people are glossing over how monumental killing off native x86 support is.

    Edited by Fake_Blood at 20:49:40 23-06-2020
  • THFourteen 23 Jun 2020 20:51:07 53,685 posts
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    @Fake_Blood this means no boot camp right?

    I have friends who would never have bought a Mac if they couldnít boot camp it.
  • fontgeeksogood 23 Jun 2020 20:53:31 9,718 posts
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    Phattso wrote:
    fontgeeksogood wrote:
    Looking forward to the big announcement that iOS apps will work natively on the Macs (because refactoring for a totally new chipset will invariably have casualties)
    Not sure if serious? This was announced and demoed yesterday.
    LOL, really?

    Fucking hell. They're not even trying to hide it anymore
  • THFourteen 23 Jun 2020 20:58:48 53,685 posts
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    Whatís a computer?
  • ozthegweat 23 Jun 2020 21:00:51 2,500 posts
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    I have some apps I rely on for work (Sketch, Atom and a few more) that will get ported way before I'll ever need to upgrade (just got a 16" MBP), but I need to run virtual machines for web development. Even with my current setup I'm waiting for quite a bit for tools like Grunt and Vagrant to finish their jobs. I dread to think how painfully slow that would be under emulated x86 on ARM.

    With Edge now available on macOS, at least I don't need to also run a Windows machine.
  • elstoof 23 Jun 2020 21:07:09 25,682 posts
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    THFourteen wrote:
    @Fake_Blood this means no boot camp right?

    I have friends who would never have bought a Mac if they couldnít boot camp it.
    Windows runs on arm already so it shouldnít be too difficult to have some sort of boot camp in the future
  • Fake_Blood 23 Jun 2020 21:23:22 10,377 posts
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    Yeah thereís a reason you havenít heard much about arm Windows in the last years.
  • beastmaster 23 Jun 2020 21:25:05 20,704 posts
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    Apple have got MS Office up and running on the new processors. No reason why they canít get Boot Camp onto it.
  • fontgeeksogood 23 Jun 2020 21:26:56 9,718 posts
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    Any word on Minesweeper
  • THFourteen 23 Jun 2020 21:30:51 53,685 posts
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    @beastmaster the iPad version of office is shit
  • beastmaster 23 Jun 2020 21:34:03 20,704 posts
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    THFourteen wrote:
    @beastmaster the iPad version of office is shit
    Ah, Iím using the full fat version on the iMac. I can imagine it being a Ďmare on an iPad. Even with a magic keyboard and mouse.
  • Phattso 24 Jun 2020 00:01:37 25,306 posts
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    Fake_Blood wrote:
    I donít want to sound like the old guy that needs his pc to run legacy software, but I do think people are glossing over how monumental killing off native x86 support is.
    People said the same about PowerPC. Somehow that worked out. As youíve said, youíll just move over to a Windows laptop. I guess theyíve run the numbers based on usage and decided thatís a risk worth taking.

    That said, with universal binaries, they can walk back the decision at any point if the market looks like imploding. :)
  • Phattso 24 Jun 2020 00:03:07 25,306 posts
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    Fake_Blood wrote:
    Yeah thereís a reason you havenít heard much about arm Windows in the last years.
    I wonder if the delicious irony will be that Bootcamp ends up being the impetus to make it properly worthwhile to get it operating.
  • uiruki 29 Jun 2020 16:31:36 5,199 posts
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    Some benchmarks on the transition hardware have leaked, putting the approximate cost of running x86 apps on MacOS through Rosetta at about 25%.

    https://www.macrumors.com/2020/06/29/rosetta-2-benchmarks-a12z-mac-mini/

    Macrumors commenters seem to be unimpressed, but that seems really fast to me - it's already way, way faster than my 2016 Macbook and that's with hardware that's taken from a two year old iPad, then clocked down and only using half the cores. If it scales up nicely then certainly on the portable side I think it'll be really fast.
  • neilch 30 Jun 2020 17:27:43 739 posts
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    uiruki wrote:
    Some benchmarks on the transition hardware have leaked, putting the approximate cost of running x86 apps on MacOS through Rosetta at about 25%.

    https://www.macrumors.com/2020/06/29/rosetta-2-benchmarks-a12z-mac-mini/

    Macrumors commenters seem to be unimpressed, but that seems really fast to me - it's already way, way faster than my 2016 Macbook and that's with hardware that's taken from a two year old iPad, then clocked down and only using half the cores. If it scales up nicely then certainly on the portable side I think it'll be really fast.
    They seems to have gone away after reading those comments :-)

    .... in their other story on this topic the site seems a lot more upbeat

    https://www.macrumors.com/2020/06/29/apple-rosetta-2-a12z-beats-surface-pro-x/
  • neilch 30 Jun 2020 17:27:43 739 posts
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    Post deleted
  • uiruki 30 Jun 2020 17:54:55 5,199 posts
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    I think if nothing else the episode has nicely explained Apple's request for people not to benchmark the thing!
  • Armoured_Bear 30 Jun 2020 18:05:35 28,823 posts
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    25% seems pretty fcking good to me.
  • beastmaster 30 Jun 2020 21:16:08 20,704 posts
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    Armoured_Bear wrote:
    25% seems pretty fcking good to me.
    Have you decided what you're going to go with regards your iMac?
  • nickthegun 2 Jul 2020 15:55:22 81,772 posts
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    RIP Bootcamp. Apparently they are going to concentrate on the 'virtualisation' route, so no direct booting into windows anymore.
  • Phattso 2 Jul 2020 16:13:38 25,306 posts
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    Bootcamp used to be everywhere when I first started using Macs as my main machine, back in 2009. Can't remember the last time I even heard of or saw anyone in real life actually still using it.

    Windows laptops aren't the clusterfuck they were back in the day, and the Mac ecosystem is a lot more healthy than it was (i.e. enough games on Steam that you wouldn't even need it for that). A lot of smart firms are ditching the Windows/Office monopoly too, which was always the biggest draw I think?

    Got to think it's a relatively tight niche still actively using it?
  • nickthegun 2 Jul 2020 16:18:11 81,772 posts
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    Im the only person I know who still uses it and thats only because some forensic tooling I use is windows only.

    Tbh, its only laziness thats stopped me creating a virtualbox machine to sit alongside my kali one.
  • Fake_Blood 2 Jul 2020 16:53:58 10,377 posts
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    Totally depends what you do with your mac I guess. Just last week I had to reflash firmware on a customerís router, the executable was windows only. Might only be like 1% of use cases but that 1% tends to be when youíre already working late and itís going to be super frustrating simply not having the option. And no, I would never flash firmware from a virtualised environment. I do fully realise that Iím an edge case though, still will be sad to see it go.
  • Phattso 2 Jul 2020 17:42:44 25,306 posts
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    Yeah - I'm not saying there's literally nobody using it... but if you're only keeping it around to flash firmwares... TIGHT NICHE! :)

    And if you love flashing firmwares that much why don't you get a Windows laptop? #StevesDefenseForce
  • Armoured_Bear 2 Jul 2020 18:22:20 28,823 posts
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    beastmaster wrote:
    Armoured_Bear wrote:
    25% seems pretty fcking good to me.
    Have you decided what you're going to go with regards your iMac?
    The latest rumours suggest it won't be here till Q4 , I might give it another week and pick up a Mac Mini.
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