The Woke AF Thread Page 10

  • nickthegun 11 Feb 2019 22:12:32 77,097 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 13 years ago
    nudistpete wrote:
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    It's always a bit dangerous to draw those kind of equivalencies.
    I'd disagree. Women are capable as being just as shitty as men and we should hold everyone to the same standard.

    It irks me that people pay lip service to equality, yet few people seem to actually want it.
    We aren't equal, though. That's kind of the point.
  • nudistpete 11 Feb 2019 22:14:14 597 posts
    Seen 6 hours ago
    Registered 2 years ago
    drhickman1983 wrote:
    Most women hating men seem to be salty because Tracy wouldn't suck their dick.
    Or they've gone through a childcare battle. Those guys are very bitter, and usually they've good reason to be so.
  • Tonka 12 Feb 2019 04:57:32 29,322 posts
    Seen 13 hours ago
    Registered 15 years ago
    I would not sympathize with a man who hated all women because of a custody battle
  • thelzdking 12 Feb 2019 04:58:56 9,154 posts
    Seen 1 hour ago
    Registered 10 years ago
    What about if the women control the office thermostat and it's always too bloody hot?
  • Tonka 12 Feb 2019 05:47:07 29,322 posts
    Seen 13 hours ago
    Registered 15 years ago
    nudistpete wrote:


    I'd disagree. Women are capable as being just as shitty as men and we should hold everyone to the same standard.

    Yes, women can be assholes. But surely you agree that it's no where near as systemic as men's abuse of women?

    Take this shit for example
    https://www.androidpolice.com/2019/02/11/google-and-apple-under-fire-for-hosting-saudi-app-for-tracking-women/

    These discussions usually end up with "men on average do more damage to themselves (drugs, poor grades, suicide)" plus lose custody, vs women who are raped, murdered, locked up, get acid thrown in their face, get their clits cut off with shards of glass, vaginas sewn shut.

    I honestly don't see the asshattery as even close to equal.

    But I'd be furious if I lost custody of my children.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 12 Feb 2019 07:04:11 14,667 posts
    Seen 4 hours ago
    Registered 13 years ago
    nudistpete wrote:
    drhickman1983 wrote:
    Most women hating men seem to be salty because Tracy wouldn't suck their dick.
    Or they've gone through a childcare battle. Those guys are very bitter, and usually they've good reason to be so.
    Sure. But they still get to be men with every advantage a patrichal society gives them.

    Nobody should be hating an entire group of people no matter what their experience is. But itís always a false equivalence to compare the behaviour of a marginalised or oppressed group to that of an advantaged or privledged one. And itís reductive to say everyone should be held to the same standard because of that.

    To give an extreme example to prove the point. Do you think itís the same for a black person to hate all racist people as it is for a racist person to hate all black people?

    When society is totally equal then we can hold everyone to the same standard. Until then the privledged and advantaged should be held to a higher standard.
  • StanDarsh 12 Feb 2019 07:25:18 125 posts
    Seen 6 days ago
    Registered 7 years ago
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    nudistpete wrote:
    drhickman1983 wrote:
    Most women hating men seem to be salty because Tracy wouldn't suck their dick.
    Or they've gone through a childcare battle. Those guys are very bitter, and usually they've good reason to be so.
    Sure. But they still get to be men with every advantage a patrichal society gives them.



    You have clearly never been through a divorce involving kids if you think that men hold all the cards in that situation.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 12 Feb 2019 07:32:38 14,667 posts
    Seen 4 hours ago
    Registered 13 years ago
    Iím just saying beyond that one area of disadvantage, they are still advantaged in pretty much every other area of life.
  • Dougs 12 Feb 2019 07:36:33 88,516 posts
    Seen 3 hours ago
    Registered 16 years ago
    Hard to argue with that.
  • StanDarsh 12 Feb 2019 07:50:07 125 posts
    Seen 6 days ago
    Registered 7 years ago
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    Iím just saying beyond that one area of disadvantage, they are still advantaged in pretty much every other area of life.
    Lol, that one area of disadvantage, like it's a minor peccadillo! I agree generally we are still a predominantly patriarchal society, but that is changing at a steady pace. I agree with empowering women I just disagree that that concept should go hand in hand with denigrating men.
  • Mola_Ram 12 Feb 2019 07:58:42 19,495 posts
    Seen 13 minutes ago
    Registered 7 years ago
    If two sides start off massively unequal, imo balancing that inequality necessarily involves the currently-dominant side losing something in the bargain.
  • Tonka 12 Feb 2019 07:59:48 29,322 posts
    Seen 13 hours ago
    Registered 15 years ago
    Margaret Atwood has said that one of her goals with The Handmaids tale was to NOT invent anything new. Everything that happens in Gilead is real, things that are happening or have been happening, but it is condensed nto the same time and space.

    Imagine doing a similar thing but with all the horrible things men have to suffer.

    It probably would look like modern day London.
  • StanDarsh 12 Feb 2019 08:14:47 125 posts
    Seen 6 days ago
    Registered 7 years ago
    Mola_Ram wrote:
    If two sides start off massively unequal, imo balancing that inequality necessarily involves the currently-dominant side losing something in the bargain.
    But how does creating additional inequality rectify inequality? Let's say we're two crazy gun toting yanks. We go out on a hunting trip and I drink too many beers and accidentally shoot you in the foot. Our situation is unequal as I've haven't been shot. Do you rectify that inequality by shooting me in the foot or do you let me drive you to hospital?

    Or maybe call an ambulance...drunk driving is bad kids mmmkay?
  • challenge_hanukkah 12 Feb 2019 08:17:06 10,244 posts
    Seen 3 hours ago
    Registered 6 years ago
    The sooner we're all asexual the better.
  • Tonka 12 Feb 2019 08:23:53 29,322 posts
    Seen 13 hours ago
    Registered 15 years ago
    StanDarsh wrote:
    Mola_Ram wrote:
    If two sides start off massively unequal, imo balancing that inequality necessarily involves the currently-dominant side losing something in the bargain.
    But how does creating additional inequality rectify inequality?

    Or maybe call an ambulance...drunk driving is bad kids mmmkay?
    I think he meant that the dominant side has to give up some of its privileges. Its unfair advantages.
  • Load_2.0 12 Feb 2019 08:24:40 28,893 posts
    Seen 54 minutes ago
    Registered 16 years ago
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    Iím just saying beyond that one area of disadvantage, they are still advantaged in pretty much every other area of life.
    The above is one of the reasons there is frustration from the feminist community towards men who transition into women, especially later in life.

    If you look at someone like Caitlyn Jenner who benefited from decades of those advantages as an athlete, a father and in business to go on and win "Woman of the Year" awards and be championed in that sort of fashion could cause friction given the challenges women have to overcome in everyday life.
  • Load_2.0 12 Feb 2019 08:26:27 28,893 posts
    Seen 54 minutes ago
    Registered 16 years ago
    challenge_hanukkah wrote:
    The sooner we're all asexual the better.
    Way ahead of you.
  • arty 12 Feb 2019 08:26:47 512 posts
    Seen 9 hours ago
    Registered 14 years ago
    Prezactly.
  • Tonka 12 Feb 2019 08:27:45 29,322 posts
    Seen 13 hours ago
    Registered 15 years ago
    challenge_hanukkah wrote:
    The sooner we're all asexual the better.
    This is one point where I find the english language lacking. Maybe it's just that I've reached my limits when it comes to the english language.

    In swedish there are two separate words for equality. One means everything is equal, all differentiators are erased, there is no difference between men and women.

    The other means everyone should have equal standing and opportunity. It recognises that things are different (e.g men and women) but that it's unfair to apply one set of arbitrary limitations upon one party but not the other (e.g women aren't allowed to drive a car)
  • Decks Best Forumite, 2016 12 Feb 2019 08:27:51 18,988 posts
    Seen 3 hours ago
    Registered 4 years ago
    Trans beat woman in equality top trumps I believe.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 12 Feb 2019 08:43:14 14,667 posts
    Seen 4 hours ago
    Registered 13 years ago
    Load_2.0 wrote:
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    Iím just saying beyond that one area of disadvantage, they are still advantaged in pretty much every other area of life.
    The above is one of the reasons there is frustration from the feminist community towards men who transition into women, especially later in life.

    If you look at someone like Caitlyn Jenner who benefited from decades of those advantages as an athlete, a father and in business to go on and win "Woman of the Year" awards and be championed in that sort of fashion could cause friction given the challenges women have to overcome in everyday life.
    I completely understand and empathise with women than feel that frustration. Itís important for them to feel recognised and listened to, but equally they need to recognise that trans women are also marginalised and also need empathy and recognition.

    I think again itís not helpful to hold up extreme exceptions of athletes and such as indicative of a broader issue. I agree the athlete thing is more complex; more so than I had appreciated before. But Kaitlin Jenner is about as severe an outlier as you can get.
  • nickthegun 12 Feb 2019 08:49:36 77,097 posts
    Seen 2 hours ago
    Registered 13 years ago
    I wonder how the cosmic scales of justice balance between the shit women have to go through their entire lives and the shit men have to go through after they transition.

    In slightly soap opera style, I know someone whos husband cheated on her with a pre-op. After they divorced, she fully transitioned and they got married. Apparently hardly any of his god fearing family turned up and her family had already more or less disowned her. It's not exactly an easy ride.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 12 Feb 2019 08:54:01 14,667 posts
    Seen 4 hours ago
    Registered 13 years ago
    StanDarsh wrote:
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    Iím just saying beyond that one area of disadvantage, they are still advantaged in pretty much every other area of life.
    Lol, that one area of disadvantage, like it's a minor peccadillo! I agree generally we are still a predominantly patriarchal society, but that is changing at a steady pace. I agree with empowering women I just disagree that that concept should go hand in hand with denigrating men.
    And nobody has said it should.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 12 Feb 2019 08:55:14 14,667 posts
    Seen 4 hours ago
    Registered 13 years ago
    nickthegun wrote:
    It's not exactly an easy ride.
    Quite, and also not a choice, which is potentially implied when you talk about the supposed advantages gained when transitioning.
  • StanDarsh 12 Feb 2019 09:04:14 125 posts
    Seen 6 days ago
    Registered 7 years ago
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    StanDarsh wrote:
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    Iím just saying beyond that one area of disadvantage, they are still advantaged in pretty much every other area of life.
    Lol, that one area of disadvantage, like it's a minor peccadillo! I agree generally we are still a predominantly patriarchal society, but that is changing at a steady pace. I agree with empowering women I just disagree that that concept should go hand in hand with denigrating men.
    And nobody has said it should.
    Apart from numerous posts from people making statements like "I can sympathise with women that hate all men".
  • Load_2.0 12 Feb 2019 09:06:10 28,893 posts
    Seen 54 minutes ago
    Registered 16 years ago
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    Load_2.0 wrote:
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    Iím just saying beyond that one area of disadvantage, they are still advantaged in pretty much every other area of life.
    The above is one of the reasons there is frustration from the feminist community towards men who transition into women, especially later in life.

    If you look at someone like Caitlyn Jenner who benefited from decades of those advantages as an athlete, a father and in business to go on and win "Woman of the Year" awards and be championed in that sort of fashion could cause friction given the challenges women have to overcome in everyday life.
    I completely understand and empathise with women than feel that frustration. Itís important for them to feel recognised and listened to, but equally they need to recognise that trans women are also marginalised and also need empathy and recognition.

    I think again itís not helpful to hold up extreme exceptions of athletes and such as indicative of a broader issue. I agree the athlete thing is more complex; more so than I had appreciated before. But Kaitlin Jenner is about as severe an outlier as you can get.
    It is an extreme example but that's what makes it so useful. It highlights the differences that men and women experience in life and why a Trans woman claiming they must be 100% accepted as female isn't that straightforward.

    For me it's the same as someone who grows up white in the US and identifies with black culture to the point where they identify as African American and go on to want to be fully accepted as part of that community.

    Your experience in life is a huge part of who/what you are.

    It's complex and that's why I feel the discussion shouldn't simply be accept the current PC mandate without question.
  • Load_2.0 12 Feb 2019 09:09:34 28,893 posts
    Seen 54 minutes ago
    Registered 16 years ago
    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    nickthegun wrote:
    It's not exactly an easy ride.
    Quite, and also not a choice, which is potentially implied when you talk about the supposed advantages gained when transitioning.
    For the majority I'm sure it's not but you can't say that it's not a choice for every single Trans person.
  • mothercruncher 12 Feb 2019 09:13:23 16,036 posts
    Seen 4 hours ago
    Registered 13 years ago
    You get arrested and throwd in jail if you stand up to piss these days.
  • Load_2.0 12 Feb 2019 09:14:27 28,893 posts
    Seen 54 minutes ago
    Registered 16 years ago
    Especially in a playground.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 12 Feb 2019 09:33:57 14,667 posts
    Seen 4 hours ago
    Registered 13 years ago
    Load_2.0 wrote:
    It's complex and that's why I feel the discussion shouldn't simply be accept the current PC mandate without question.
    What is the wording of that current PC mandate just out of interest?
Log in or register to reply

Sometimes posts may contain links to online retail stores. If you click on one and make a purchase we may receive a small commission. For more information, go here.