New Mcdonalds strikes Page 2

  • drhickman1983 13 Nov 2019 07:47:03 6,613 posts
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    The incentive would be to not do something shit and tedious? To do something satisfying?

    That, to me, is a bigger incentive than money in many ways. I'd be all for McDonald employees, and other shit jobs, getting paid more.

    Edited by drhickman1983 at 07:47:20 13-11-2019
  • You-can-call-me-kal 13 Nov 2019 07:47:20 19,435 posts
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    Yeah I agree job desirability is not just about pay. And I agree profits should be equally distributed (Iím not sure I even agree with profits full stop). But the communist ideal of all jobs are equal and all pay is equal has been shown time and time again not to work in reality.
  • drhickman1983 13 Nov 2019 07:48:18 6,613 posts
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    Literally nobody is asking for total wage equality though
  • fontgeeksogood 13 Nov 2019 07:49:04 9,523 posts
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    I feel CAD design engineers should earn less
  • Mola_Ram 13 Nov 2019 07:50:47 23,552 posts
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    This is completely anecdotal. But I've heard from multiple people who hire in the hospitality industry that ex-McDonalds employees do rather well getting other jobs. I don't know what their reputation is like in other countries (or if it's even deserved), but here they're thought to be exceptionally well-trained.
  • drhickman1983 13 Nov 2019 07:51:55 6,613 posts
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    They should just bask in the warm glow of seeing their engineering designs in practical use.

    Edited by drhickman1983 at 07:52:06 13-11-2019
  • You-can-call-me-kal 13 Nov 2019 07:52:06 19,435 posts
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    drhickman1983 wrote:
    Literally nobody is asking for total wage equality though
    Not directly. I have a hunch someone in this discussion believes in that.

    BTW itís not as simple as highly skilled is interesting and low skilled is boring. There are many jobs that are incredibly difficult and highly skilled but boring as fuck. Actuaries etc. Why would anyone do that job if the pay wasnít good?
  • drhickman1983 13 Nov 2019 07:55:29 6,613 posts
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    Most jobs, when it comes down to it, are pretty tedious and boring as fuck.

    I still think the lowest paid jobs, when being provided by a company with a massive profit margin, should earn a decent wage for the bullshit they have to put up with.
  • fontgeeksogood 13 Nov 2019 07:56:35 9,523 posts
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    I've worked within actuarial department. The reasons aren't financial (the constant exams and studying requirements doesn't make it all that lucrative on an hourly basis) a lot of times, there's people who just love numbers and pretend scenarios.

    Yes, of course they are scary
  • rice_sandwich 13 Nov 2019 07:57:05 6,426 posts
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    All jobs should earn a decent wage, really. I suppose those that produce money rather than social capital tend to be the better paid ones.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 13 Nov 2019 07:59:16 19,435 posts
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    Thereís no disagreement on the corporate drone thing.

    But I donít agree with you about jobs. The enjoyment/fulfilment scale is as wide as the remuneration one, and they donít always directly correlate.
  • drhickman1983 13 Nov 2019 08:00:43 6,613 posts
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    Then there are things like McDonalds where fulfilment and renumeration is both low.
  • TheSaint 13 Nov 2019 08:01:18 19,486 posts
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    I always assumed most branches of McDonalds were franchises so the profits of the parent company are not really related to the ability of individual branches to pay that much.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 13 Nov 2019 08:01:24 19,435 posts
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    fontgeeksogood wrote:
    I've worked within actuarial department. The reasons aren't financial (the constant exams and studying requirements doesn't make it all that lucrative on an hourly basis) a lot of times, there's people who just love numbers and pretend scenarios.

    Yes, of course they are scary
    My brother in law does it and hates it, and is very much in it for the money. But whether thatís a good example or not, there are a lot of highly skilled that people only do for the money, and arenít interesting and rewarding.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 13 Nov 2019 08:01:57 19,435 posts
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    drhickman1983 wrote:
    Then there are things like McDonalds where fulfilment and renumeration is both low.
    Yes...
  • Deleted user 13 November 2019 08:02:32
    nickthegun wrote:
    racing_fan wrote:
    I have two points. 1, I realised it's London but even still does a McDonald's employee really warrant £30k even in London?
    Well, two points right back. One, 30k is probably not far off a baseline wage for someone who works in central London and, two, the 30k thing is completely erroneous as very few McDonald's employees will get full time hours thanks to this wonderful gig economy there Tories have gifted us with.
    True, true.

    Look I realised that I actually don't care. It takes cojones to risk unemployment at this time of year, so they must believe in what they're doing at least.
  • TheSaint 13 Nov 2019 08:11:24 19,486 posts
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    On the plus side, people will be eating less shit food while this strike is taking place so that's a net benefit for the country.
  • nickthegun 13 Nov 2019 08:12:45 81,385 posts
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    Mola_Ram wrote:
    This is completely anecdotal. But I've heard from multiple people who hire in the hospitality industry that ex-McDonalds employees do rather well getting other jobs. I don't know what their reputation is like in other countries (or if it's even deserved), but here they're thought to be exceptionally well-trained.
    It also seems like one of those places where if you can stick it out, you do get rewarded. I know a couple of people who dropped out of education because when they worked there, they just kept getting promotion after promotion because the staff turnover is so high.
  • Graxlar_v3 13 Nov 2019 08:20:50 9,933 posts
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    I donít think anyone should argue against people being paid more, though I would prefer it if the cost didnít trickle down to the final selling price (of course it will).

    The only other question is, how did they get to the £15 figure, is this the amount required to live in London? If so shouldnít it be the living wage?
  • Load_2.0 13 Nov 2019 08:29:17 31,406 posts
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    Has anyone been into a London McDonald's recently?

    Try an 8-10 shift in a McDonald's dealing with either the front of house abuse or working a high pressure cooking conveyor belt.

    They also have a number of further education and management training schemes that are excellent training if you go into hospitality.

    I've no problem with 15 quid.
  • drhickman1983 13 Nov 2019 08:35:52 6,613 posts
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    I'd be fine with 15 quid per hour for McDonalds staff outside of London, such is the shit they have to put up with.

    That would actually be earning more than me, but I'm fine with that as I'm not going to get all high and mighty and superior.

    Edited by drhickman1983 at 08:36:50 13-11-2019
  • rice_sandwich 13 Nov 2019 08:38:24 6,426 posts
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    The real living wage is/will be £10.75 per hour in London, so going up to £15 is around a 40% pay increase. Although whether MacDonalds / franchise owners would actually end up paying more is debatable. They could up wages but slash staff numbers and hours to maintain the same (or lower) wage bill.
  • Tonka 13 Nov 2019 08:47:30 30,677 posts
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    You-can-call-me-kal wrote:
    I donít disagree with this, but whatís the incentive for training for years for a difficult highly skilled job if the pay is the same?
    One reason could bee to spend 8 hrs a day doing something you like rather than something you don't. This is why free/cheap education is important so that people don't end up in debt.

    It's all highly theoretical since I doubt there will ever be a situation where all jobs pay equally.
  • You-can-call-me-kal 13 Nov 2019 08:49:35 19,435 posts
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    Again, some highly skilled jobs are boring and unpleasant, but well paid.
  • rice_sandwich 13 Nov 2019 08:52:16 6,426 posts
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    @Tonka

    How about Sweden? How do the lower paid get on? The UK media are always banging on about how we should try to be more like Sweden (Denmark, Norway, Finland) and become more progressive and try to extend social justice initiatives.
  • PazJohnMitch 13 Nov 2019 08:55:53 15,706 posts
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    I donít think people outside London realise how expensive it is to live here. And commuting doesnít really help as you cannot drive into the centre and trains to London are very expensive at commuter times.

    Studies generally put zones 4/5 as the cheap spot where mortgages + train costs are lowest.

    Southall is a local shit hole to me in this Ďsweetí spot. Discounting Shared-Ownership bollocks prices of studio flats start at £200k, with £280k being the starting price for 1 bed properties.

    So for 2 people to buy a studio flat in this Ďlovelyí location they need a combined earnings of 200/4.5 = £44k or £22k each. I would put that as the absolute lowest anyone should be paid. And would be more appropriate for part time (20-25 hours) than full time 35-45.

    The 1 bed price would be a fairer point to target for full time as sharing a studio flat is pretty much unworkable. That works out at £31k each which is essentially what the staff are asking for. (Doesnít seem like an unreasonable target)
  • drhickman1983 13 Nov 2019 08:58:02 6,613 posts
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    Banging on about how some jobs are skilled and well paid but boring feels a bit like what-about-ary.

    Those jobs will almost certainly still pay more, even after the proposed wage increase / demand.

    Edited by drhickman1983 at 08:58:26 13-11-2019
  • Graxlar_v3 13 Nov 2019 08:58:36 9,933 posts
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    I have to pay £11 on TFL a day to travel into work every day. That is a big chunck of money every month when you add in the other £60 i pay on buses a month. Couple that with a mortgage/ground rent/maintenance and spending nearly a grand on childcare a month. Shit is expensive, i wouldn't begrudge anyone the money to actually live.
  • JamboWayOh 13 Nov 2019 09:06:56 18,852 posts
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    Won't someone think of the CAD design engineers?!
  • Graxlar_v3 13 Nov 2019 09:07:24 9,933 posts
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    JamboWayOh wrote:
    Won't someone think of the price of a double sausage and egg mcmuffin?!
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