Following Coronavirus Page 551

  • Technoishmatt 23 May 2020 09:37:21 4,741 posts
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    I would have no problems whatsoever with this being the time for him to go. But he was has a pretty big get out clause in terms of if both parents were ill and worried about being able to look after their kids.

    We had baby 2 arrive yesterday and we needed granny to come look after baby 1 so I could go to the hospital. Is that breaking the rules?
  • simpleexplodingmaybe 23 May 2020 09:45:58 15,263 posts
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    Heís played us all pretty masterfully diverting so much attention away from himself and onto the BBC like this

    Plus heís a long-standing opponent of the BBC because of its neutrality so this way heís getting his own supporters and the left to tear it down for him

    Edited by simpleexplodingmaybe at 09:47:13 23-05-2020
  • simpleexplodingmaybe 23 May 2020 09:49:08 15,263 posts
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    BBC has long been opposed by the Mail/Express right but been able to resist so getting the Momentum left to join in could be the tipping point these antidemocratic populists have been waiting for
  • ZuluHero 23 May 2020 09:49:50 9,488 posts
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    Technoishmatt wrote:
    We had baby 2 arrive yesterday and we needed granny to come look after baby 1 so I could go to the hospital. Is that breaking the rules?
    If granny completely shielded for at least 2 weeks prior then it's fine.
  • JoelStinty 23 May 2020 10:28:51 9,099 posts
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    X201 wrote:
    Does The Guardian or Mirror say why this has taken a month to be reported?

    Has the source only just come forward?
    Archie Bland (Deputy National Editor) said that they went to Cummings over six weeks ago trying to get a response.

    https://twitter.com/archiebland/status/1263937116754640907

    Guess its taken that time to corroborate stuff.

    It does raise questions about who knew. I would imagine that they wouldn't be the only ones who did. Quite a lot of attention now seems to be on the Spectator, Mail and BBC, all who had published pieces on how the Cummings had spent lockdown in London.

    https://twitter.com/peterjukes/status/1263980443482767360
  • TheSaint 23 May 2020 10:55:27 20,085 posts
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    Technoishmatt wrote:
    I would have no problems whatsoever with this being the time for him to go. But he was has a pretty big get out clause in terms of if both parents were ill and worried about being able to look after their kids.
    The idea that you are too ill to look after your child but well enough to drive 250miles seems a bit of a stretch. Surely in those circumstances the person doing the looking after (now they are saying his sister) comes to you.

    Also interesting that the government introduced the caveat for using kids to break lockdown the day after the Mirror and Guardian first asked them for comment on this story.

    Edited by TheSaint at 11:06:03 23-05-2020
  • Dougs 23 May 2020 10:58:40 96,536 posts
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    Ha, didn't know that last bit.
  • bzzct 23 May 2020 10:59:13 2,040 posts
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    https://twitter.com/gabyhinsliff/status/1264097267885236224?s=20

    repeating what source says in response to hostile story is not Ďbeing a mouthpieceíí, itís reporting. It matters to repeat the alibi exactly; sometimes it *does* explain why a thing that looks bad actually isnít but sometimes it shows the excuse just raises more Qs than As).Didnít they have a single friend in London to help? Is this really what a normal person would do? But you show, donít tell. Let readers decide. Repeating the alibi exactly matters because if it changes under pressure (weak alibis often do) you want to be able to show that.

    Thread then goes on to talk about the complexities around sourcing.

    Edit: and ends with the crux of the issue:
    Final nerd point; I think Twitter *structurally* is hell for balanced reporting. encourages telling story in dribs & drabs before all clear; advantages those who can get rebuttal out quicker; ppl cherrypick single tweets from series. Itís an issue for BBC.

    Edited by bzzct at 11:10:36 23-05-2020
  • richardiox 23 May 2020 11:13:23 9,140 posts
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    bzzct wrote:
    https://twitter.com/gabyhinsliff/status/1264097267885236224?s=20

    repeating what source says in response to hostile story is not Ďbeing a mouthpieceíí, itís reporting. It matters to repeat the alibi exactly; sometimes it *does* explain why a thing that looks bad actually isnít but sometimes it shows the excuse just raises more Qs than As).Didnít they have a single friend in London to help? Is this really what a normal person would do? But you show, donít tell. Let readers decide. Repeating the alibi exactly matters because if it changes under pressure (weak alibis often do) you want to be able to show that.

    Thread then goes on to talk about the complexities around sourcing.
    I agree with this if there's a grey area and two sides to the story. But in this context Cummings is bang to rights. It's unequivocal. Readers can decide if he's in the right or wrong on based on the FACT that he made that trip up north without having to have "his side" parroted by the BBC (which is non factual eg "he had no other choice and didn't break rules)

    For example, when I speak to my Dad later (he's a Daily Mail guy) if I mention this story he'll counter me with the narrative that "sources" have put out there. They've created enough wiggle room for him to now get away with it.

    Edit - fuck me. Number 10 now saying the Durham Police are lying?!!!??? This is some Donald Trump playbook shit.

    Edited by richardiox at 11:17:37 23-05-2020
  • askew 23 May 2020 11:23:41 22,120 posts
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    I don't recall such an eager defence of Mr Professor Man:


    -small number of people in No 10 knew that Cummings had gone to Durham, not stayed in London -seems it was his sister who had offered to help with childcare when he and his wife fell ill
    -family stayed in separate house + had no contact in the end

    3. No 10 statement continues -ĎAt no stage was he or his family spoken to by the police about this matter, as is being reported. His actions were in line with coronavirus guidelines. Mr Cummings believes he behaved reasonably and legally.í
    Durham Police confirms they spoke to owners of house where Ďan individualí was staying who had travelled from London to Durham
    Who's telling porkies Ė or are they using the 'about this matter'?
  • KnuttinAtoll 23 May 2020 11:28:52 8,381 posts
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    Just watched Alastair Campbell on BBC News absolutely tearing into Johnson & co (and a jab at the media) over the Cummings story. He was spot on as well, pretty much in line with opinions in this thread. Quite entertaining, too.
  • X201 23 May 2020 11:32:43 20,964 posts
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    JoelStinty wrote:
    X201 wrote:
    Does The Guardian or Mirror say why this has taken a month to be reported?

    Has the source only just come forward?
    Archie Bland (Deputy National Editor) said that they went to Cummings over six weeks ago trying to get a response.

    https://twitter.com/archiebland/status/1263937116754640907

    Guess its taken that time to corroborate stuff.

    It does raise questions about who knew. I would imagine that they wouldn't be the only ones who did. Quite a lot of attention now seems to be on the Spectator, Mail and BBC, all who had published pieces on how the Cummings had spent lockdown in London.

    https://twitter.com/peterjukes/status/1263980443482767360
    Ta for the link.
    Thatís what I was getting at with the question. Nothing like that stays secret in Westminster for long - never mind six weeks - it just seemed odd that it hadnít come out somehow/where
  • Decks 23 May 2020 11:37:20 27,417 posts
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    There's no way the horrible little Moby cunt will resign. Why would he? Actions mean nothing anymore. Especially if your party doesn't even pretend to have morals.
  • X201 23 May 2020 11:43:33 20,964 posts
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    simpleexplodingmaybe wrote:
    BBC has long been opposed by the Mail/Express right but been able to resist so getting the Momentum left to join in could be the tipping point these antidemocratic populists have been waiting for
    That the saddest and most irritating part.
    The Momentum left attacking the BBC, each time giving the Tories ammo to destroy it a little more.
    Momentum will be the first ones to weep when the BBC is neutered by more cuts and all thatís left is a cash strapped Guardian vs the massed ranks of the right wing media
  • X201 23 May 2020 11:46:05 20,964 posts
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    Decks wrote:
    There's no way the horrible little Moby cunt will resign. Why would he? Actions mean nothing anymore. Especially if your party doesn't even pretend to have morals.
    Yep,
    It will end up as a tiny bit of ďthing that happened four years agoĒ ammo at the next election
  • Dgzter 23 May 2020 11:56:36 3,431 posts
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    Yeah, nothing is going to come of this. Sadly.

    Dunt is right here: https://twitter.com/IanDunt/status/1264147481778106370?s=20

    You can already see the carefully coordinated results of their internal briefing this morning. Messages of support from all quarters of government, positioning it as a point of parental principle and moral rectitude. What honest, hard-working, family-orientated Brit could do more?

    Cunts.
  • Load_2.0 23 May 2020 12:18:56 32,281 posts
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    I'm not sure. The sheer volume of effort they are putting into defending a clear and flagrant breach might backfire here.

    This has really got people's backs up and to basically suggest people are lying including Durham police? That's a gamble.
  • richardiox 23 May 2020 12:19:08 9,140 posts
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    Amazing the government are saying that Cummings wasn't even actually ill when he broke lockdown to make the trip and was doing it in case he got ill. Makes it even worse. Preemptive free for all trips around the country everyone! But like Raab and Gove say, only if you're doing it because you love your kids.

    The contempt by which they hold us plebs is amazing. Raab is saying this shouldn't be politicised.....Public wanted an explanation, Dom has given one (he actually hasnt though in person), so we can move on. Simples!

    At least it means I can take the family to see my mum and dad tomorrow without guilt.

    Edit - their language is all very carefully worded "he didn't feel that he was breaking the rules...that wasn't his understanding" etc

    Edited by richardiox at 12:22:15 23-05-2020
  • Decks 23 May 2020 12:26:22 27,417 posts
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    Load_2.0 wrote:
    I'm not sure. The sheer volume of effort they are putting into defending a clear and flagrant breach might backfire here.

    This has really got people's backs up and to basically suggest people are lying including Durham police? That's a gamble.
    So what though? They know nothing will happen if he doesn't resign. They haven't been held to account for anything they've done so far so I can't see them giving a shit what people think about that little rat fuck breaking lockdown.
  • IMO 23 May 2020 12:39:10 7,475 posts
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    The balls on them to try and worm their way out of this.
  • JoelStinty 23 May 2020 12:44:24 9,099 posts
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    Itís all unravelling isnít it? Cummings canít even get his story straight at this point.
  • Load_2.0 23 May 2020 12:46:11 32,281 posts
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    The near identical press release style tweets of support from Raab, Sunak and Gove have incensed people as the suggestion is his family is more important than the rules.

    There's thousands of people who suffered from not being able to see dying relatives. This story is front page headlines.

    The more they defend it the more incensed people become.

    The precedent has been set by previous government advisors and it's clear for such a flagrant breach.
  • Decks 23 May 2020 12:47:42 27,417 posts
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    Hope you're right because I detest the little runt but I just can't see him going.
  • IMO 23 May 2020 12:49:28 7,475 posts
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    It's clearly the reason that the Cabinet is filled with utter imbeciles. Johnson and Cummings have surrounded themselves with incompetent morons who will unthinkingly walk out and parrot any utter nonsense in their defence with not a shred of integrity or intelligence.
  • Load_2.0 23 May 2020 12:52:38 32,281 posts
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    They have dig dug themselves a massive hole. It keeps getting deeper.

    Just need to push him into it.
  • richardiox 23 May 2020 12:53:29 9,140 posts
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    Decks wrote:
    Hope you're right because I detest the little runt but I just can't see him going.
    The comments from Downing Street this morning mean he's not going anywhere unless public sentiment gets too hot.

    One of the things I love about the Torys, they only ever show a moderate or fair side after intense external pressure. See also the U Turn on overseas NHS staff fees this week. Just a day after BJ himself justified them. A month after these staff saved his life. That's the real Tory party right there. "How else can we pay for all this?" he asks, whilst him and his whole cabinet are dripping in insane amounts of private wealth.
  • Load_2.0 23 May 2020 12:53:45 32,281 posts
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    IMO wrote:
    It's clearly the reason that the Cabinet is filled with utter imbeciles. Johnson and Cummings have surrounded themselves with incompetent morons who will unthinkingly walk out and parrot any utter nonsense in their defence with not a shred of integrity or intelligence.
    The similarity of their tweets is so clearly an instruction from the top.
  • JamboWayOh 23 May 2020 12:55:13 21,498 posts
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    If Cummings is 'perfectly within his legal right' to casually drive excess of 200 miles to his parents with symptoms then surely we can all do what the fuck we want right?
  • ZuluHero 23 May 2020 12:56:31 9,488 posts
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    I thought most people were already? :)
  • richardiox 23 May 2020 12:57:53 9,140 posts
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    ".. his first public comments since his journey from London to County Durham was reported on Friday night.

    When asked by reporters if his trip during the coronavirus lockdown looked good, he said: "Who cares about good looks. It's a question of doing the right thing. It's not about what you guys think."

    What the actual fuck. That's his message to the nation? Says it all really. You can see this guy was an architect of herd immunity. Every man for themselves, just do what you think is right. Fuck everyone else"
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