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  • orpheus 14 May 2020 11:02:31 1,867 posts
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    How about no.

    Hell, I couldn't even search the forum to see if a related topic had already been posted without enabling tracking/targeting cookies (and yes, I'm logged in). This is utterly despicable behaviour.

    It is also not lawful, as stated by the ICO's own guidance on the matter:

    The ePrivacy Directive refers to conditional access to website content in Recital 25. This is sometimes used to justify using a cookie wall. It states:

    ‘Access to specific website content may be made conditional on the well-informed acceptance of a cookie or similar device, if it is used for a legitimate purpose.’

    However, when considering Recital 25, you should note that:

    ‘specific website content’ means that you should not make ‘general access’ subject to conditions requiring users to accept non-essential cookies – you can only limit certain content if the user does not consent; and

    the term ‘legitimate purpose’ refers to facilitating the provision of an information society service – ie, a service the user explicitly requests. This does not include third parties such as analytics services or online advertising.

    If your use of a cookie wall is intended to require, or influence, users to agree to their personal data being used by you or any third parties as a condition of accessing your service, then it is unlikely that user consent is considered valid.
    https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/guide-to-pecr/guidance-on-the-use-of-cookies-and-similar-technologies/how-do-we-comply-with-the-cookie-rules/

    Note that the above refers to both 'full' cookie walls, where access to entire websites is denied unless tracking cookies are accepted, and 'partial' cookie walls where users are denied access to parts of websites or content on websites without accepting tracking cookies. To cite a 2019 article on this specific part of the ICO's guidance:

    So no cookie wall; and no partial walls that force a user to agree to ad targeting in order to access the content.
    https://techcrunch.com/2019/08/10/most-eu-cookie-consent-notices-are-meaningless-or-manipulative-study-finds/ [Note: shitty cookie wall warning - yes that is a palpable irony].

    This is further borne out by the EDPB's latest guidance (May 2020):

    In order for consent to be freely given, access to services and functionalities must not be made conditional on the consent of a user to the storing of information, or gaining of access to information already stored, in the terminal equipment of a user (so called cookie walls)

    Example 6a: A website provider puts into place a script that will block content from being visible except for a request to accept cookies and the information about which cookies are being set and for what purposes data will be processed. There is no possibility to access the content without clicking on the “Accept cookies” button. Since the data subject is not presented with a genuine choice, its consent is not freely given.

    This does not constitute valid consent, as the provision of the service relies on the data subject clicking the “Accept cookies” button. It is not presented with a genuine choice.
    https://edpb.europa.eu/our-work-tools/our-documents/guidelines/guidelines-052020-consent-under-regulation-2016679_en

    Tracking/targeting cookies constitute personal data under the GDPR and Eurogamer's use of such cookies to block access to video content and site functionality is clearly intended to require and/or influence users to agree to provide their personal data as a condition of accessing parts of the service, thereby invalidating any consent given. It is not lawful, and it must stop.

    EG has lost a long-time reader over this, and I bet I'm not the only one, and I have now reported EG to the ICO. Enjoy the eventual enforcement action.

    Edit: typo & inclusion of search functionality behind same cookie wall.

    Edited by orpheus at 14:14:54 14-05-2020
  • magicpanda 14 May 2020 11:27:34 15,035 posts
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    You can turn them off?

  • richarddavies 14 May 2020 11:29:45 7,762 posts
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    NOT GOOD ENOUGH PANDA! THE WHOLE SYSTEM NEEDS TO COME DOWN!!

    AND I WATCHED A RECENT DF VIDEO YESTERDAY AND I WAS FUMING. WHERE WAS HIS FUCKING POPPY??
  • magicpanda 14 May 2020 11:31:53 15,035 posts
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    I take that back he is right.
  • hedben2013 14 May 2020 11:52:06 1,604 posts
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    orpheus wrote:
    How about no.

    Hell, I couldn't even search the forum to see if a related topic had already been posted...
    Just Google: (thing you want to search) site:community.eurogamer.net

    No I will not shut up about this, yes I will always say it when someone complains about searching the forum
  • orpheus 14 May 2020 12:02:28 1,867 posts
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    hedben2013 wrote:
    orpheus wrote:
    How about no.

    Hell, I couldn't even search the forum to see if a related topic had already been posted...
    Just Google: (thing you want to search) site:community.eurogamer.net

    No I will not shut up about this, yes I will always say it when someone complains about searching the forum
    Way to miss the point Mr Patronising. The forum search functionality will not work unless you allow tracking cookies. This is obvious limiting of functionality to influence users to accept tracking cookies, which as noted in the OP, is unlawful.
  • ZuluHero 14 May 2020 12:15:45 8,925 posts
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    That's not what you said though - that the site was blocking you from video content. I only have essential cookies and i'm not blocked from anything.

    Everyone knows search doesn't work, it's like a running joke at this point.
  • orpheus 14 May 2020 12:23:56 1,867 posts
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    ZuluHero wrote:
    That's not what you said though - that the site was blocking you from video content. I only have essential cookies and i'm not blocked from anything.

    Everyone knows search doesn't work, it's like a running joke at this point.
    Jesus christ, is the whole forum incapable of reading?! I said:

    Hell, I couldn't even search the forum to see if a related topic had already been posted without enabling tracking/targeting cookies
    Try it. Disable targeting cookies, then try the forum search function. You will immediately be presented with a window saying "To see this content please enable targeting cookies."

    This isn't about whether the forum search works or doesn't work. It's about the fact that the search function (whether it works or not) is locked behind a targeting cookie wall, same as the video content.

    Edit: spelling.

    Edit2: also, if you've only allowed essential cookies (same as me), then you'd be blocked from seeing videos too. Might wanna check those settings.

    Edited by orpheus at 12:33:28 14-05-2020
  • Rogueywon Most Generous Forumite, 2016 14 May 2020 12:34:26 8,979 posts
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    A cookie wall sounds tasty. I want some cookies now.

    Not oatmeal-raisin, obviously.

    Edited by Rogueywon at 12:41:55 14-05-2020
  • magicpanda 14 May 2020 12:35:08 15,035 posts
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    Appears they don't even bother to save your cookie preferences either.

    Go here https://www.eurogamer.net/cookies click settings and turn everything off.

    Browse a few pages and revisit the cookie page. Click settings again and everything is turned back on for me.
  • hedben2013 14 May 2020 12:39:37 1,604 posts
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    orpheus wrote:
    hedben2013 wrote:
    orpheus wrote:
    How about no.

    Hell, I couldn't even search the forum to see if a related topic had already been posted...
    Just Google: (thing you want to search) site:community.eurogamer.net

    No I will not shut up about this, yes I will always say it when someone complains about searching the forum
    Way to miss the point Mr Patronising. The forum search functionality will not work unless you allow tracking cookies. This is obvious limiting of functionality to influence users to accept tracking cookies, which as noted in the OP, is unlawful.
    I wasn't presenting that as a solution to your extremely wordy problem, it was just a side-note
  • hedben2013 14 May 2020 12:42:21 1,604 posts
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    It's like how every time someone on this forum mentions sandwiches I have a rant about how cheese and marmalade should be just as popular as cheese and chutney. Everyone's gotta have their "thing" they won't shut up about

    Seriously, just go to Google and type "cheese and marmalade" site:community.eurogamer.net (don't use the forum search, I hear it's terrible)
  • EMarkM 14 May 2020 12:46:09 4,945 posts
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    hedben2013 wrote:
    (don't use the forum search, I hear it's terrible)
    It works fine for us Gold Users.

    Are you not a Gold User?
  • orpheus 14 May 2020 12:49:20 1,867 posts
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    magicpanda wrote:
    Appears they don't even bother to save your cookie preferences either.

    Go here https://www.eurogamer.net/cookies click settings and turn everything off.

    Browse a few pages and revisit the cookie page. Click settings again and everything is turned back on for me.
    Preferences save for me. Maybe your browser is blocking all cookies? Only reason I can think of that it would be different.
  • ZuluHero 14 May 2020 12:59:45 8,925 posts
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    @orpheus

    Tbf you did vomit a wall of text.

    I can't confirm if what you say is true, as the preference isn't saved like MagicPanda says, so it enables automagically for me.
  • askew 14 May 2020 13:01:02 21,552 posts
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    magicpanda wrote:
    Appears they don't even bother to save your cookie preferences either.

    Go here https://www.eurogamer.net/cookies click settings and turn everything off.

    Browse a few pages and revisit the cookie page. Click settings again and everything is turned back on for me.
    Is that because they need to set a cookie to save them? :D Probably bad form to have one opted in by default though…
  • orpheus 14 May 2020 13:08:33 1,867 posts
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    ZuluHero wrote:
    @orpheus

    Tbf you did vomit a wall of text.

    I can't confirm if what you say is true, as the preference isn't saved like MagicPanda says, so it enables automagically for me.
    @ZuluHero Granted, but the section you misread was literally the second sentence. If it was three or four paras in I could understand it. Anyway, no offense meant, was just a bit of a facepalm moment on my side.

    That it 'magically' enables tracking cookies is actually worse from a legal standpoint, as it would mean they're collecting personal data without any consent whatsoever. That could land them with serious financial penalties, not to mention it being an utter dick move.

    That said, my preferences save, though I've not tried to browse multiple articles in succession to see if those preferences revert. Will check.

    Edit: Nope, ran through 10 plus articles without leaving the site, my cookies are still set to essential only. Retaining that setting requires a cookie to be set, so any browser setting that blocks all cookies will result in it returning to default on each site visit (though in theory then, you should see the cookie preferences selector on each visit too).

    Edited by orpheus at 13:15:26 14-05-2020
  • BigOrkWaaagh 14 May 2020 13:17:25 9,441 posts
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    I really like oatmeal raisin cookies
  • Tomo 14 May 2020 13:25:58 17,805 posts
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    I've been banging this drum for a month or so now. It's really annoying. It might be okay if you could actually get a reliable answer for what clicking Agree entails, but fuck knows and wading through everything to find out is a total PITA.

    You know it's a joke when RPS - owned by the same Roger ReedPop - apologises for it when it detects you haven't said yes:

    "To experience this #content, you will need to enable targeting cookies. Yes, we know. Sorry."

    It's like they given up as well.
  • orpheus 14 May 2020 13:39:37 1,867 posts
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    Tomo wrote:
    I've been banging this drum for a month or so now. It's really annoying. It might be okay if you could actually get a reliable answer for what clicking Agree entails, but fuck knows and wading through everything to find out is a total PITA.

    You know it's a joke when RPS - owned by the same Roger ReedPop - apologises for it when it detects you haven't said yes:

    "To experience this #content, you will need to enable targeting cookies. Yes, we know. Sorry."

    It's like they given up as well.
    RPS does it as well? Christ. That's another one to cross off the list then.

    Shame, since it's unlawful in both cases. Eventually (and it will take ages) the ICO will fine the shit out of them for it, but that's often the only way companies learn.
  • KnuttinAtoll 14 May 2020 14:01:24 8,146 posts
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    I think the obvious question here is, what has the OP to hide from craigy?
  • neilka 14 May 2020 14:03:59 23,404 posts
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    The Cookie Settings button doesn't even do anything in Chrome 👍
  • ZuluHero 14 May 2020 14:21:43 8,925 posts
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    @orpheus Yeah I can't opt out at all. I thought for a minute if it was because i'm logged in on other devices, like my phone as well, so completely logged out and tried again.

    They still reset to always on, for everything!

    I probably should have read the part about giving them my first-born when I clicked ok...
  • orpheus 14 May 2020 14:33:00 1,867 posts
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    @ZuluHero How strange. Checked to see if your browser is preventing all cookies being set? Only thing I can think of at this point.
  • Nazo 14 May 2020 15:17:23 1,366 posts
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    The Reedpop cookie policy explicitly says that disabling targeting cookies will not affect functionality so they aren't even compliant with their own policy.

    I'm using uBlock and Privacy Badger and don't have any issues watching the vids though.
  • orpheus 14 May 2020 17:05:12 1,867 posts
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    Nazo wrote:
    The Reedpop cookie policy explicitly says that disabling targeting cookies will not affect functionality so they aren't even compliant with their own policy.
    Well spotted!
  • nickthegun 14 May 2020 17:21:30 82,264 posts
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    neilka wrote:
    The Cookie Settings button doesn't even do anything in Chrome 👍
    That’s confidence for you.
  • Graxlar_v3 14 May 2020 17:40:31 10,212 posts
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    FFS.. I have been hitting the give me cookies button for 15 minutes and haven’t had a single one :(.

    Also, noob question... apart from hiding the sites you have been going on at work, why does it matter?
  • Decks Best Forumite, 2016 14 May 2020 17:44:15 25,562 posts
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    I always feel like I should care more about tracking cookies. At the moment my care level for tracking cookies is somewhere around zero. Should I be moving that up to to 1 or even 2?
  • gamingdave 14 May 2020 17:51:44 5,002 posts
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    Nazo wrote:
    The Reedpop cookie policy explicitly says that disabling targeting cookies will not affect functionality so they aren't even compliant with their own policy.

    I'm using uBlock and Privacy Badger and don't have any issues watching the vids though.
    uBlock and PB are the way forward.

    EGs policy isn't GDPR compliant, the ability to decline cookies isn't given the same prominence as accept and is on a second screen. It's also not clearly labelled as decline, but as "save settings" which forces the user to check none have defaulted to on.

    But good luck finding a major site, especially a news orientated one out there who is!

    So many still don't let you properly opt out, or make it harder to opt out than in, which is not allowed.

    Doesn't help when most are using off the shelf solutions, and those providers themselves are making non-compliant plugins. They should, but if they did, site operators would choose one of the alternatives because they would really rather not have people decline.

    TheDailyMash is probably the closest to being clear :D
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