Following Returnal - Housemarque PS5 exclusive Page 39

  • SolidSCB 4 May 2021 11:48:49 15,772 posts
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    Decks wrote:
    nickthegun wrote:
    Ah, I was just waiting for an upgrade. Speaking of yellow things... is there any penalty for killing those yellow octopus things?
    Think you're just supposed to get them as quickly as possible before they disappear.
    They are basically your Cactuars of Returnal. They give you a fuckload of Obolites so chase them down asap and kill as many as you can. I don't think they attack at all so don't worry about being sloppy if it's just them in a room.
  • Daeltaja 4 May 2021 12:01:42 2,031 posts
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    Post-game is actually very slim pickings. There's a secret ending to get (can be done in a single long run) and items/artifacts/ciphers etc to mop up, but that's it really. Kind of disappointed there's not more to it, but in the same breadth, I may actually platinum it.
  • JoelStinty 4 May 2021 12:02:10 9,424 posts
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    Just started this up. Left a really strong first impression. Certainly entices you to play more. Love how fluid it is.
  • neems 4 May 2021 12:10:29 5,392 posts
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    monkman76 wrote:
    Thread's got quieter - has the initial wow worn off? Hovering over 'buy' at the moment.
    It's fantastic. I can certainly see how it wouldn't be for everyone, but wow.
  • nickthegun 4 May 2021 12:26:18 86,445 posts
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    UncleLou wrote:
    monkman76 wrote:
    Thread's got quieter - has the initial wow worn off? Hovering over 'buy' at the moment.
    If I may say so: it's good, and it mostly has the AAA polish, but as a roguelite/like, Hades is a better game. Based on my limited and admittedly frustrating experience so far, mind. :)
    Itís biggest problem, I think, is that itís a Ďproperí game on top of everything else. In hades, if you die to a boss, youíre back there in 30 minutes, tops. In this it takes so long to reach and get geared enough to have a crack at it, itís completely dispiriting when you die because you sink so much time into just one run.

    The second time I got to the B3 boss, I had low health, low resources, a crap gun and I had scoured most of the level. I sat outside the boss room for a few minutes thinking Ďwhatís the point?í which Iím sure isnít the vibe they are going for.

    All that said, I think they have got most things spot on, itís just a bit crushing to lose so much progress in one go.
  • ChiefGB 4 May 2021 12:28:16 13,675 posts
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    Does this game have mic sounds? Given all the other stuff itís doing, I guess so?
  • Decks 4 May 2021 12:29:16 29,821 posts
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    Yeah that's where I'm at with my current run at the B2 boss. Fuck all health, and I've scoured the entire level. So its pretty much just suicide.
  • Switch-v85 4 May 2021 12:31:03 4,287 posts
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    I'm loving it, not a fan of rogue-likes usually and I'm not sure the label does this game any favours. It has all the elements but it feels very much like it's own thing.
  • Derblington 4 May 2021 12:32:03 34,881 posts
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    ChiefGB wrote:
    Does this game have mic sounds? Given all the other stuff itís doing, I guess so?
    Yeah, but not much. There's an indicator for when your alt-fire is ready to use, but I'm not sure of anything else.

    Edited by Derblington at 12:32:13 04-05-2021
  • ChiefGB 4 May 2021 12:39:41 13,675 posts
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    @nickthegun thatís a bit of my worries on this. The runtimes sound just a bit too long with the game structure as it is. Iím probably the kind of Person to spend my time progressing cautiously, then just get wrecked out of nowhere. Think I may lose focus with this over time. Itís hard to just dust yourself down and commit another couple of hours.
    Unless the loop really is THAT good? It does sound like a game worth trying though and I need something for this white beast gathering dust under my tv.
  • wuntyate 4 May 2021 12:40:00 17,031 posts
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    Been reading this thread with interest but I still can't find it in me to get this. I think the frantic combat is putting me off. I keep getting shades of Doom Eternal with it's convoluted 3D map and arenas full of monsters that require lightning evasion and super accuracy, brightly coloured collectables spilling everywhere. That coupled with the reports of how long runs are etc... Am I very wrong? I won't now get it this close to RE8 but I would still consider picking it up after.
  • ChiefGB 4 May 2021 12:40:58 13,675 posts
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    Derblington wrote:
    ChiefGB wrote:
    Does this game have mic sounds? Given all the other stuff itís doing, I guess so?
    Yeah, but not much. There's an indicator for when your alt-fire is ready to use, but I'm not sure of anything else.
    Ah ok, not missing too much by muting then, I am fairly partial to the odd controller sound 🤣
  • Decks 4 May 2021 12:49:36 29,821 posts
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    The boss fights aren't even that hard, bit it's always going to take a few goes to learn them. So when you die you know you've got another fucking slog to get to powerful enough to fight them again. It's an amazing game and an absolute joy to play, but it feels like something you need to play for 8 hours straight to progress with at times. With an hour here or there I'm struggling to get into the some with it. Real live fucks everything up again.
  • Derblington 4 May 2021 12:52:14 34,881 posts
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    wuntyate wrote:
    Been reading this thread with interest but I still can't find it in me to get this. I think the frantic combat is putting me off. I keep getting shades of Doom Eternal with it's convoluted 3D map and arenas full of monsters that require lightning evasion and super accuracy, brightly coloured collectables spilling everywhere. That coupled with the reports of how long runs are etc... Am I very wrong? I won't now get it this close to RE8 but I would still consider picking it up after.
    Primary differences are that there's no intended way to kill stuff to balance resources or weapon switching. It's simply just avoid bad projectiles while shooting enemies. You don't really equip stuff mid-fight either

    I'm not a fan of Eternal, despite really liking D16, and I think this is great.
  • Dougs 4 May 2021 12:54:16 99,139 posts
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    Decks wrote:
    The boss fights aren't even that hard, bit it's always going to take a few goes to learn them. So when you die you know you've got another fucking slog to get to powerful enough to fight them again. It's an amazing game and an absolute joy to play, but it feels like something you need to play for 8 hours straight to progress with at times. With an hour here or there I'm struggling to get into the some with it. Real live fucks everything up again.
    That was my worry and why I haven't pulled the trigger yet.
  • nickthegun 4 May 2021 12:54:43 86,445 posts
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    I mean, thereís nothing inherently wrong with a long run because the pacing of building your character is actually pretty great. Itís just a killer when itís all gone.
  • UncleLou Moderator 4 May 2021 12:55:48 40,532 posts
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    Yeah, absolutely. It was the boss that fucked me up. Now I died enough in between, don't get me wrong, but I don't mind that. Give me an hour with boss, and I will learn his patterns, but once every few hours isn't enough. I only survived him by sheer luck (and with an astronaut).

    The closest I came to beating him before that was when his room was right next to the crashed ship. I went in there immediately after a failed attempt, with just the starting pistol and nothing else. I am not even sure a better weapon or more health makes a dramatic difference (the astronaut did, though).

    Edited by UncleLou at 12:56:42 04-05-2021
  • monkman76 4 May 2021 12:59:11 18,583 posts
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    Thanks for all the comments. I've bought it, I need to feel, see and hear it and I can't see it coming down in price for a good while.
  • Derblington 4 May 2021 13:00:31 34,881 posts
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    Other than the first boss I've beat them all 1st go. As long as you're playing the levels rather than shortcutting (which does require the play time, granted) you should be strong enough to beat them.
    Having a large health vial is recommended - it full heals your health bar so you can pop it when real low and you basically have a second life.
    Most constructors sell them and they aren't costly.

    Edited by Derblington at 13:01:50 04-05-2021
  • quadfather 4 May 2021 13:01:08 38,709 posts
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    wuntyate wrote:
    Been reading this thread with interest but I still can't find it in me to get this. I think the frantic combat is putting me off. I keep getting shades of Doom Eternal with it's convoluted 3D map and arenas full of monsters that require lightning evasion and super accuracy, brightly coloured collectables spilling everywhere. That coupled with the reports of how long runs are etc... Am I very wrong? I won't now get it this close to RE8 but I would still consider picking it up after.
    It's the frenetic combat that clicks straight away, or it did for me. It's different to doom where you've got a million options and various buttons to press while in mid-air etc with perfectly timed jumps - it's not like that.

    It's more sort of, "Right, how many bellends do we have in this room. Hm, ok, 4-5. Fuck it, lets take that guy out first, pew pew. Ah shit, that ones flanking me, let me get back a bit, right, that's you sorted out. Argh, wanker, where did you come from, pew pew. Fuck this, there's some health over there, I'll get that. Right, come on then, fuckers"

    It's more like that. And it's very visceral, especially when you get the melee weapon and want to wreak some havoc.

    It's streamlined in it's design - there's a jump button, a dash button and an alt fire button, melee attack if you want, and that's pretty much it.

    As for the stuff they drop, only the currency stuff has a timer before it expires. Everything else will stay on the ground so you can leave all that till the room is cleared and then go mop up afterwards.

    Most of the starter goons are fine, then occasionally it mixes it up a bit and sometimes you'll get a big sod that takes a bit more of a careful approach, but once it all clicks, the combat is just simply great fun.

    It's just the bosses for me with the auto-induced panic mode ala souls
  • quadfather 4 May 2021 13:03:23 38,709 posts
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    monkman76 wrote:
    Thanks for all the comments. I've bought it, I need to feel, see and hear it and I can't see it coming down in price for a good while.
    Yeah, it's difficult to explain via text - you really need to experience it for yourself
  • quadfather 4 May 2021 13:06:52 38,709 posts
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    And I've got a feeling from the people in here that have got further that while later monsters sound much harder, it seems (afaik) that the first area is the most punishing while you get used to it, and then you've got the boss. I'm totally wank with bosses, but I know I will beat this guy. It's not as hard as souls. I'd say if you had to compare, the first boss in this is about the same as maybe artorias - doable, but you have to learn it.
  • nickthegun 4 May 2021 13:09:35 86,445 posts
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    Derblington wrote:
    Other than the first boss I've beat them all 1st go. As long as you're playing the levels rather than shortcutting (which does require the play time, granted) you should be strong enough to beat them.
    Iíve found it take pretty much three runs to complete a level. One to open it up, one to learn it and unlock weapon traits and a Ďbigí boss run where you do *everything*. The first two, it doesnít matter if you shortcut but a boss run does seem to require deliberate preparation and grinding the previous content.
  • wuntyate 4 May 2021 13:13:52 17,031 posts
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    quadfather wrote:
    It's more sort of, "Right, how many bellends do we have in this room. Hm, ok, 4-5. Fuck it, lets take that guy out first, pew pew. Ah shit, that ones flanking me, let me get back a bit, right, that's you sorted out. Argh, wanker, where did you come from, pew pew. Fuck this, there's some health over there, I'll get that. Right, come on then, fuckers"
    Heh, that actually gives me a pretty good idea.

    Still on the fence so I'll just sit a while longer. It seems like it's something I very much need to experience, yet I'm not in the right zone for this sort of thing just now. So I'll trust my guts. They haven't let me down before apart from that one time I took a chance and accidentally shit myself.
  • Derblington 4 May 2021 13:18:19 34,881 posts
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    nickthegun wrote:
    Derblington wrote:
    Other than the first boss I've beat them all 1st go. As long as you're playing the levels rather than shortcutting (which does require the play time, granted) you should be strong enough to beat them.
    Iíve found it take pretty much three runs to complete a level. One to open it up, one to learn it and unlock weapon traits and a Ďbigí boss run where you do *everything*. The first two, it doesnít matter if you shortcut but a boss run does seem to require deliberate preparation and grinding the previous content.
    I guess I'm more methodical and tend to get all approaches down into one run. I've died a few times mid-mission due to new enemies or poor tactical choices but I tend to take them slow, choose equipment to pick-up now or later, and back-track when needed to power-up.
    It does mean that one run lasts hours though, so I need to sit a chunk of time to play.
  • Mark1412 4 May 2021 13:18:21 2,171 posts
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    On the flip side of it having longish run times sometimes and the fear of losing progress is the sweet, unforgettable feeling of fuck yes when you do make a significant leap forward, whether it's a piece of equipment, boss or shortcut. Add me to the love it camp. Wish I was at home playing it.
  • quadfather 4 May 2021 13:24:36 38,709 posts
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    @wuntyate

    Yeah, I know what you mean. I was the same, and even more put off by the rogue stuff, but the pros definitely outweigh the cons.

    I mean, the con's are basically 1) Can't currently save your run, and runs can take either a short time or a very long time. They will always take a long time in a new area and beginners in the first area. 2) If it's a long run, and you need to go shopping suddenly or whatever, putting it in rest mode with it still running in the background is your only option. Turning the game off will take you right back to the start (at least until you get to the 4th area, then it starts from there all the time).

    However, the pros -

    1) Amazing visceral tight combat that is satisfying.
    2) Progression clearly gets better/easier the more you play (took me 3 hours to clear the first area because I pootle, whereas I could probably get to the boss door in about 15-20 minutes now, if I get a lucky dungeon generation)
    3) Not everything needs doing each run. For instance, you have to get a key to open the boss door. I got it, died to the boss, started another run looking for the key again, but you don't need to - it's permanently unlocked now. So you can just make a beeline for the boss if you want. It's not recommended though without gearing up properly with +health +decent weapon though.
    4) Level design and layout is really good. This is a fucked up planet with plenty of mystery going on.
    5) Graphics top notch
    6) Sound is incredible especially through headphones
    7) Things like parasites and malfunctions are genuinely interesting and useful. Do you pick up this thing that increases your protection or health, but at the cost of weakening something else?

    All in all, top fun. I just hope I get good enough to see it all.
  • Phattso 4 May 2021 13:28:32 27,101 posts
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    Not a game I'm likely to play any time soon but I'm interested if, in a world of speed runners, is there any mileage at all in making a beeline for the boss and just practicing over and over until you can kill it without taking any damage? One presumes that with enough knowledge and practice you can evade a bunch of damage?

    I'm just thinking of a couple of difficulty spikes I had in Ghost of Tsushima where I'd bang my head against a boss fight for an hour, and then final switch to dodge/parry and rinse them. :)
  • quadfather 4 May 2021 13:35:50 38,709 posts
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    @Phattso

    I'd put money on speedrunning videos coming out soon yes. Like others have said, the bosses aren't that hard - The first one appears to be a difficulty spike for most people, but even I can last a couple of phases with him and without hugely upgrading on the way to him. The difficulty with making a beeline is that you'll have a crappy pistol which will take a long time to drop a boss I'd have thought. But there is a specific room that always drops a weapon from a chest - you could get lucky with a decent rng drop and then carry on to the boss without the +health stuff if you're confident enough with your skills to evade being hit.

    Plus, there are benefits to killing monsters without getting hit. It encourages this by rewarding you with adrenaline rewards - kill 3 in a row without taking damage and you'll get an upgrade - keep doing it and it stacks up to 5 different bonuses. All which reset if you get hit, so there's incentives in there to learn how to survive properly.
  • Trowel 4 May 2021 13:38:10 24,370 posts
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    monkman76 wrote:
    Thanks for all the comments. I've bought it, I need to feel, see and hear it and I can't see it coming down in price for a good while.
    This week's 20% off eBay code means you could get it from ShopTo for about £58. Personally I'm sticking with my backlog until there's a change in direction on saves.
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