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I know the laptop has been covered but what do we think the effect/impact may be? Having just read the BBC article on it I am wondering if this will be the intiative to push linux into the mainstream enough to get a backing. Governments will only be able to commit to a million machines. That means in anyone place a million users will be generated. If that isn't incentive enough for developers to get programming I don't know what is. So will this be the beginning of the end for a certain OS company or just a blip in the line? |
Effect of sub $100 laptops
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ScoutTech 2,428 posts
Seen 4 years ago
Registered 17 years ago -
Okay. For $100 dollars you can fit out a classroom in developing countries for 60 pupils. $1 dollar buys immunisation. The govenment are going to stump up the money to pay $100 per laptop rather than feed its people?
A few more points:
- How are the pupils supposed to know how to use the laptops? Training costs money.
- How will they have access to the internet when there would not be a CAT5 network in many places....if in any? Networks would be an additional cost.
- what about the software? Where will that come from and who pays for it?
The reality of this is likely to be more than £100 dollars needing to be spent to include training and software.
When whole families are being wiped out by malaria and the annual average income is around $300 pa, a fucking laptop is not going to be a concern. I find this whole idea disturbing, ignorant and quite sickening as to the levels of arrogance.
On newsnight the woman trying to flog this hardware didn't even look in the slightest bit convinced by her own arguments! -
RedboX 2,427 posts
Seen 12 years ago
Registered 19 years agoI dont know about anyone else, but having seen them Newsnight, I want one!!
I have a feeling that a lot of them might end up in the hands of Geeks... Maybe thats the solution, give them to kids in developing nations along with an ebay account. -
pauleyc 4,548 posts
Seen 17 hours ago
Registered 20 years agoMax, you sound quite bitter about the whole idea.
It's not really a choice for governments: cheap laptops versus immunization; your point sounds rather far-fetched to me. Look at this as the next step. Immunization might cost 1$, a classroom 100$ but how much for equipping said classroom with low-end machines - surely more than 100$ per user (I am refering to the whole setup - monitor, keyboard, box with innards etc. - not even thinking about portability)?
In my opinion the idea has great potential and the emphasis on education is promising. The actual hardware specifications however rule out any large corporate software investments, more likely small developers with own localised offers. So in this respect Microsoft will survive; at best the 100$ laptops will help to educate a future user base aware of other solutions
edit: BBC story
Edited by pauleyc at 10:30:10 17-11-2005 -
ScoutTech 2,428 posts
Seen 4 years ago
Registered 17 years agoRedboX wrote:
I dont know about anyone else, but having seen them Newsnight, I want one!!
I have a feeling that a lot of them might end up in the hands of Geeks... Maybe thats the solution, give them to kids in developing nations along with an ebay account.
Glad someone else is up for a light hearted disscussion too.gif)
They have said they are trying to get them on the open market. Seems ideal way of subsidising, sell them to Geeks at $500 mark, then be able to drop the price on others.
@ Madder Max: I think the idea is to try and get people to empower themselves to allow them to get themselves up. You'd prob think the same about mobile phones in Africa. Why when there is so much need else where. But actually people are using them in suprising ways to help themselves. One guy has managed to set up a supermarket, in a shanty town to supply basics. He does his ordering and accepts orders by SMS. Also an African engineer has made a new currency by creating phone cards that you can transfer money on by SMS. Has taken of in a big way so people can avoid carrying money around on them and avoid big bank fees. I'll see if I can dig up the article I was reading about.
Cheers PaulyC, should have linked to the article really
Edit: Here's the other article I was talking about. Mainly about the new way they are doing loans out there but goes on to talk about the other schemes
Edited by ScoutTech at 10:31:38 17-11-2005
Edited by ScoutTech at 10:34:03 17-11-2005 -
But people need to be trained on how to use the laptop. This is not empowerment. get the kids into school first. There they can learn, socialise and gain a sense of empowerment by developing their own minds....a sense of self
Why try and shove a laptop in there to make them feel empowered? What happens if u take the laptop away? -
pauleyc 4,548 posts
Seen 17 hours ago
Registered 20 years agoMadder Max wrote:
Well, I imagine the software might include an extensive tutorial suitable for kids.
But people need to be trained on how to use the laptop. This is not empowerment. get the kids into school first. There they can learn, socialise and gain a sense of empowerment by developing their own minds....a sense of self
Why try and shove a laptop in there to make them feel empowered? What happens if u take the laptop away?
And the laptop is not a way to replace schools, it's delivering technology at an affordable price. Empowering - in a way; preventing children from poor regions to be completely left behind in the modern world.
Have you considered the possible savings from moving to electronic books?
edit: Max, do you also criticise this idea?
Edited by pauleyc at 10:49:10 17-11-2005 -
RedboX 2,427 posts
Seen 12 years ago
Registered 19 years agoScoutTech wrote:
They have said they are trying to get them on the open market. Seems ideal way of subsidising, sell them to Geeks at $500 mark, then be able to drop the price on others.
$500 is a bit pricey for something thats been desiged to be manufactured in bulk and sold for around $100.
I wonder if they are looking for developers.
Edited by RedboX at 10:50:20 17-11-2005 -
RedboX 2,427 posts
Seen 12 years ago
Registered 19 years agoScoutTech wrote:
Glad someone else is up for a light hearted disscussion too
I was talking to my co-worker about these laptops this morning and the first thing she said was "great, now the africans can compete with Nigerians for email scams". -
RedboX wrote:
O_o
I was talking to my co-worker about these laptops this morning and the first thing she said was "great, now the africans can compete with Nigerians for email scams".
She an idiot, then? (Rhetorical) -
marilena 8,238 posts
Seen 2 weeks ago
Registered 18 years agoMax, you're dead wrong. I'm not from Africa, but Eastern Europe isn't that rich a place either and I would have given anything for a computer when I was kid, but my parents could not even dream of buying me one. I had to go to a special clun that had a few Spectrum clones and only one or two PCs. If I could have gotten my hands on one, trust me, I would have managed to learn how to use it. Anyway, you're talking like they live in a world with no teachers or something.
Edit: the nigerian schemes where by actual nigerians?
Edited by marilena at 11:01:52 17-11-2005 -
RedboX 2,427 posts
Seen 12 years ago
Registered 19 years agoRetroid wrote:
RedboX wrote:
O_o
I was talking to my co-worker about these laptops this morning and the first thing she said was "great, now the africans can compete with Nigerians for email scams".
She an idiot, then? (Rhetorical)
Idiot or not, she sort of has a point. The more people you get on the internet the more of them are going to try and use it as a means to try and con thier fellow man out of something.
and if you dont belive that I've my uncle needs to get $100,000,000 out of Iraq and if you send me your bank details you can keep 50%...... -
RedboX 2,427 posts
Seen 12 years ago
Registered 19 years agomarilena wrote:
Max, you're dead wrong. I'm not from Africa, but Eastern Europe isn't that rich a place either and I would have given anything for a computer when I was kid, but my parents could not even dream of buying me one. I had to go to a special clun that had a few Spectrum clones and only one or two PCs. If I could have gotten my hands on one, trust me, I would have managed to learn how to use it. Anyway, you're talking like they live in a world with no teachers or something.
Edit: the nigerian schemes where by actual nigerians?
I think we in the west forget how lucky we are to be able to afford such expensive items (as spectrums).
the Nigerian scam is just a term for Advance fee fraud, mosly because its recent popularity started with people tring to get money out of Nigeria...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigerian_scam -
pauleyc 4,548 posts
Seen 17 hours ago
Registered 20 years agoRedboX, that's rather a human trait - one might say that the number of criminals increases with the growth of a population (but education should have a positive impact on this, right?).
I vote for "idiot", btw..gif)
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RedboX 2,427 posts
Seen 12 years ago
Registered 19 years agopauleyc wrote:
RedboX, that's rather a human trait - one might say that the number of criminals increases with the growth of a population (but education should have a positive impact on this, right?).
Your quite correct, but as Im a miserable old curmudgeon/pessimist I just belive education is going to teach them how to con them out of my life saving in new ways. -
Furbs wrote:
Max, think of the VOIP possibilities! If I were you I'd start learning the various African languages now
Oh yeah....they wont have to go legacy...
This is a great idea!!!
/Shows big shit-eating grin
/pound signs in eyes...
Still dont get how they will connect to the net though... -
ScoutTech 2,428 posts
Seen 4 years ago
Registered 17 years agodravenclarke wrote:
the wind up power thing, was oky in a radio.. but a laptop? with a 500mhz pocesser?...
Can't remember where I read it but I'm sure I read that 3 turns woudl do about 10 mins. So depending on how many you can do at a time that could be better than batteries. Less chance of running out then with a lead and battery I suppose, I would like a windy thing on mine -
Salaman 24,162 posts
Seen 6 days ago
Registered 17 years agoIf you want to help the people in developing countries, maybe it's a good idea to go there and ask them what they think they could use some help with instead of sitting here and churning out stuff which we think they should have.
I'm pretty sure not a lot of people will ask you to please provide them with a laptop.
They may ask for food, or the means to help them produce their own food. They may ask for tools, for housing for protection from random looting, raping and murdering by child soldiers.
They may ask for the World bank to free them from historical debt that goes back to the 60s and that is still used to keep them in a WTO stranglehold or they may ask that we stop effectively keeping them off the world market with our subsidised produce and our under paying for their produce.
I can't see a laptop + internet coming in very high on the list.
It's a great idea really if you look at it from our point of view (we have a great toy, lets help others get one as well) but from their point of view, it's not very relevant to their needs. (screw toys, I need, food, shelter, etc) -
bivith 2,469 posts
Seen 9 hours ago
Registered 17 years agoRedboX wrote:
ScoutTech wrote:
Glad someone else is up for a light hearted disscussion too
I was talking to my co-worker about these laptops this morning and the first thing she said was "great, now the africans can compete with Nigerians for email scams".
/checks atlas
/notes that Nigeria is still part of Africa
/confirms that RedboX's co-worker is an idiot.
Edited by bivith at 12:00:03 17-11-2005 -
deem 31,667 posts
Seen 8 months ago
Registered 18 years ago -
marilena 8,238 posts
Seen 2 weeks ago
Registered 18 years agoSalaman, read my post. You're wrong .
Sure, a laptop is no use if you're starving, but if you aren't starving, you're just poor, a laptop can mean a lot.
Sure, even back when I was a kid, Eastern Europe never got as bad as some parts of Africa. But I don't think that Africa is as poor as it sometimes seems to ve considered. I mean, they are not in the stone age, you know. They have towns and cars and everything.
I believe with all my heart that education is a high priority anywhere in this world. Laptops will help thos kids and maybe they hold a chance to help the entire area by raising the level of education. I don't want to be too optimistic, but I think they can.
/hopeless idealist -
ScoutTech 2,428 posts
Seen 4 years ago
Registered 17 years agoSalaman wrote:
They may ask for food, or the means to help them produce their own food. They may ask for tools, for housing for protection from random looting, raping and murdering by child soldiers.
They may ask for the World bank to free them from historical debt that goes back to the 60s and that is still used to keep them in a WTO stranglehold or they may ask that we stop effectively keeping them off the world market with our subsidised produce and our under paying for their produce.
But surely you are falling into the same trap thinking that all poorer countries have these problems? I totally agree that in a place like Somalia this would be useless as the pirates would have them before they got off the boats, but what about in Brazil? Where the biggest problem is getting out of the slums or getting an education at all, or South Africa where the only way to get out of the Shanty towns is to hope for a break or get an education?
Yes there are big problems in places but if we can help some people to help themselves that is surely a step in the right direction? So instead of just giving aid all the time start planning for the future, which is where the educational aspect is a benefit.
Edit: Ohh & if I remember the background to all this the guy who is pushing it forward did spend a lot of time in the places that will benefit from these. Hence flash memory, rubber casing and wind up. Yes it seems obvious when you think about it but why then did a wind up radio take so long?
Edited by ScoutTech at 12:17:13 17-11-2005 -
ScoutTech 2,428 posts
Seen 4 years ago
Registered 17 years agomarilena wrote:
I believe with all my heart that education is a high priority anywhere in this world. Laptops will help thos kids and maybe they hold a chance to help the entire area by raising the level of education. I don't want to be too optimistic, but I think they can.
/hopeless idealist
Hear hear
On the original note does anyone else think that this may jump start/give momentum to the linux software development cause? I know it will take a few years untill the education gets through, if it all takes off, but I can't believe that a mass of user that large will shift or be forced to migrate to Windows. Or does everyone think it will stay at local developers for local people?
Edited by ScoutTech at 12:20:10 17-11-2005 -
RedboX 2,427 posts
Seen 12 years ago
Registered 19 years agobivith wrote:
RedboX wrote:
ScoutTech wrote:
Glad someone else is up for a light hearted disscussion too
I was talking to my co-worker about these laptops this morning and the first thing she said was "great, now the africans can compete with Nigerians for email scams".
/checks atlas
/notes that Nigeria is still part of Africa
/confirms that RedboX's co-worker is an idiot.
Idiot or not, the Nigerian Scams do not come from Nigeria.... -
Furbs 45,740 posts
Seen 3 months ago
Registered 18 years agoMax, think of the VOIP possibilities! If I were you I'd start learning the various African languages now -
Salaman - internet porn and forums make the world a better place though?
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