"Copernicus called" joke - Frasier - Origins

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  • bzzct 19 Apr 2006 14:56:35 2,040 posts
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    Right, I will be WELL impressed if anyone can help out with this one...

    I need to find out where the "Copernicus called; it turns out you're not the centre of the universe" joke comes from. I heard it from a mate, a quick Google tells me it appeared in Frasier (Series 10, Ep 10 - 10/12/02 US airdate, 03/03/03 UK airdate) but I don't know if this is where it comes from, or if Frasier's taken it from somewhere else.

    Anyone any ideas? Remember having heard if before then? Know for any reason why it definitely is/isn't from there/somewhere else?

    Major kudos to anyone with any even remotely useful information.
  • Carlo 19 Apr 2006 14:59:09 21,382 posts
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    You've never played Civilization, have you?
  • christourlord 19 Apr 2006 14:59:18 2,839 posts
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    I assume it's derived from the age-old "Yesterday called - says it wants its [insert thing] back" joke.
  • WarKitty 19 Apr 2006 15:00:42 566 posts
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    Carlo wrote:
    You've never played Civilization, have you?

    lol
  • bzzct 19 Apr 2006 15:02:24 2,040 posts
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    christourlord wrote:
    I assume it's derived from the age-old "Yesterday called - says it wants its [insert thing] back" joke.
    That would make sense, though even if so it's the Copernicus-specific version I need info on.

    @Carlo:
    I've played about 10mins of Civlization in my life, so if you're suggesting a better knowledge of it would provide me the answer I'm afraid I'd need it spelt out ;-).

    @WarKitty:
    Damnit, now I feel stupid.

    Edited by Kolmar at 15:03:08 19-04-2006
  • WarKitty 19 Apr 2006 15:05:03 566 posts
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    Kolmar wrote:
    christourlord wrote:
    I assume it's derived from the age-old "Yesterday called - says it wants its [insert thing] back" joke.
    That would make sense, though even if so it's the Copernicus-specific version I need info on.

    @Carlo:
    I've played about 10mins of Civlization in my life, so if you're suggesting a better knowledge of it would provide me the answer I'm afraid I'd need it spelt out ;-).

    @WarKitty:
    Damnit, now I feel stupid.

    Edited by Kolmar at 15:03:08 19-04-2006

    I think hes hinting that Copernicus lived a long time ago.. so in theory somebody (and you could never prove either way) could have made that joke the day after Copernicus shared his findings.
  • bzzct 19 Apr 2006 15:06:22 2,040 posts
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    WarKitty wrote:
    I think hes hinting that Copernicus lived a long time ago.. so in theory somebody (and you could never prove either way) could have made that joke the day after Copernicus shared his findings.
    Is he??!

    Well he's not doing it very well... :-P.

    Edit: And if we're going to be pedantic about it then it would at least need to be post-invention of telephone, surely ;-).

    Edited by Kolmar at 15:07:08 19-04-2006
  • GrandTheftApu 19 Apr 2006 15:09:16 6,117 posts
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    Not really it could refer to calling round to visit.
  • Carlo 19 Apr 2006 15:11:13 21,382 posts
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    WarKitty wrote:
    I think hes hinting that Copernicus lived a long time ago.. so in theory somebody (and you could never prove either way) could have made that joke the day after Copernicus shared his findings.
    I am?

    Well not really.

    heliocentric theory of Copernicus. ie back then Copernicus went against 'popular' religious theory that the universe revolved around the earth, and that in fact, the Earth was not the 'center of the universe'.

    Your joke (IMO) implies that when copernicus 'called', it was to inform the person you're insulting that the universe does not (in fact) revolve around them.

    WTF am I talking about? Here you go

    Edited by Carlo at 15:19:24 19-04-2006
  • WarKitty 19 Apr 2006 15:11:17 566 posts
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    GrandTheftApu wrote:
    Not really it could refer to calling round to visit.

    Or that he 'called out' or yelled over some distance.
  • bzzct 19 Apr 2006 15:16:35 2,040 posts
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    Carlo wrote:
    WarKitty wrote:
    I think hes hinting that Copernicus lived a long time ago.. so in theory somebody (and you could never prove either way) could have made that joke the day after Copernicus shared his findings.
    I am?

    Well not really.

    heliocentric theory of Copernicus. ie back then Copernicus went against 'popular' religious theory that the universe revolved around the earth, and that in fact, the Earth was not the 'center of the universe'.

    Your joke (IMO) implies that when copernicus 'called', it was to inform the person you're insulting that the universe does not (in fact) revolve around them.
    I have no idea where Civilization comes into any of that... ;-).

    (or why your post negates the effect of the joke?)

    WarKitty wrote:
    GrandTheftApu wrote:
    Not really it could refer to calling round to visit.

    Or that he 'called out' or yelled over some distance.
    Yeah but it clearly doesn't :-P.

    Edited by Kolmar at 15:17:31 19-04-2006

    Edited by Kolmar at 15:18:36 19-04-2006
  • WarKitty 19 Apr 2006 15:18:36 566 posts
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    Kolmar wrote:
    Carlo wrote:

    Well not really.

    heliocentric theory of Copernicus. ie back then Copernicus went against 'popular' religious theory that the universe revolved around the earth, and that in fact, the Earth was not the 'center of the universe'.

    Your joke (IMO) implies that when copernicus 'called', it was to inform the person you're insulting that the universe does not (in fact) revolve around them.
    I have no idea where Civilization comes into any of that... ;-).

    You get nifty bits of info like that in it if you read everything.
  • bzzct 19 Apr 2006 15:20:02 2,040 posts
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    WarKitty wrote:
    You get nifty bits of info like that in it if you read everything.
    Ah right, didn't get that, I use the internet for that ;-).
  • WarKitty 19 Apr 2006 15:20:03 566 posts
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    Kolmar wrote:
    Yeah but it clearly doesn't :-P.
    How do you know?
    :p
  • Salaman 19 Apr 2006 15:20:27 23,871 posts
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    I reckon all these ;-) smileys are not kind natured winks as some of you are no doubt assuming.

    I reckon Kolmar is a man on the edge and that's just his eye twitching right before he snaps and goes postal on everyone in this thread.

    /leaves thread quickly
  • Carlo 19 Apr 2006 15:23:06 21,382 posts
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    Kolmar wrote:
    I have no idea where Civilization comes into any of that... ;-).

    (or why your post negates the effect of the joke?)

    Civ (the game incedently!) had copernicus' discovery as one of the 'wonders'. If you read about the 'discovery' it would explain all that.

    My post (I hope) does not negate the joke, which I happen to find quite funny (I might even use it!)... Lovely insult to an (uneducated?') person who thinks the world of themselves.

    Pah! Who needs a classical education when they've played Civ, eh?
  • bzzct 19 Apr 2006 15:23:42 2,040 posts
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    WarKitty wrote:
    Kolmar wrote:
    Yeah but it clearly doesn't :-P.
    How do you know?
    :p
    'Cos only a freak would phrase it like that ;-).

    ;-)
    ;-) ;-)
    ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-)

    /stabs.
  • WarKitty 19 Apr 2006 15:24:41 566 posts
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    Carlo wrote:
    Pah! Who needs a classical education when they've played Civ, eh?

    Or COD2 , which I haven't played but look over reality_cheques shoulder whenever he dies to get another quote fix.
  • WarKitty 19 Apr 2006 15:26:08 566 posts
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    Kolmar wrote:
    WarKitty wrote:
    Kolmar wrote:
    Yeah but it clearly doesn't :-P.
    How do you know?
    :p
    'Cos only a freak would phrase it like that ;-).

    ;-)
    ;-) ;-)
    ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-)

    /stabs.

    /oh shit, broke another one :(
  • bzzct 19 Apr 2006 15:28:08 2,040 posts
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    Carlo wrote:
    Kolmar wrote:
    I have no idea where Civilization comes into any of that... ;-).

    (or why your post negates the effect of the joke?)

    Civ (the game incedently!) had copernicus' discovery as one of the 'wonders'. If you read about the 'discovery' it would explain all that.

    My post (I hope) does not negate the joke, which I happen to find quite funny (I might even use it!)... Lovely insult to an (uneducated?') person who thinks the world of themselves.

    Pah! Who needs a classical education when they've played Civ, eh?
    Ok, you seem to have been under the misconception I didn't know who Copernicus was, and was trying to find out to be able to understand the joke?

    I assumed your post was meant to be pointing out differences to me, rather than drawing parallels.

    I'm using the joke as a reference in the dissertation I'm currently writing, I just want to know the origins as best I can to be able to quote it properly...

    Edited by Kolmar at 15:29:01 19-04-2006
  • Carlo 19 Apr 2006 15:30:20 21,382 posts
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    Yes I was Kolmar, sorry about that.

    Your question of the origin of the joke itself is one for the author(s).
  • WarKitty 19 Apr 2006 15:30:30 566 posts
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    Kolmar wrote:
    Carlo wrote:
    Kolmar wrote:
    I have no idea where Civilization comes into any of that... ;-).

    (or why your post negates the effect of the joke?)

    Civ (the game incedently!) had copernicus' discovery as one of the 'wonders'. If you read about the 'discovery' it would explain all that.

    My post (I hope) does not negate the joke, which I happen to find quite funny (I might even use it!)... Lovely insult to an (uneducated?') person who thinks the world of themselves.

    Pah! Who needs a classical education when they've played Civ, eh?
    Ok, you seem to have been under the misconception I didn't know who Copernicus was, and was trying to find out to be able to understand the joke?

    I'm using the joke as a reference in the dissertation I'm currently writing, I just want to know the origins as best I can to be able to quote it properly...

    referencing Frasier should be sufficent, you could maybe even mention the dilemma of once speech enters general usage can it truely be 'owen' by anyone?
  • Carlo 19 Apr 2006 15:31:44 21,382 posts
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    WarKitty wrote:
    referencing Frasier should be sufficent, you could maybe even mention the dilemma of once speech enters general usage can it truely be 'owen' by anyone?
    What like the football player?
  • bzzct 19 Apr 2006 15:33:49 2,040 posts
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    WarKitty wrote:
    referencing Frasier should be sufficent, you could maybe even mention the dilemma of once speech enters general usage can it truely be 'owen' by anyone?
    If the Frasier usage is the most specific/earliest reference I can find then yes, I'll go with it. To your second point - not really, that's nothing to do with what the dissertation's about ;-).
  • Carlo 19 Apr 2006 15:35:32 21,382 posts
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    Kolmar wrote:
    ....what the dissertation's about ;-).
    ...?
  • WarKitty 19 Apr 2006 15:35:37 566 posts
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    Carlo wrote:
    WarKitty wrote:
    referencing Frasier should be sufficent, you could maybe even mention the dilemma of once speech enters general usage can it truely be 'owen' by anyone?
    What like the football player?

    I hate you.. metaphorically :p
  • bzzct 19 Apr 2006 15:39:58 2,040 posts
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    Carlo wrote:
    Kolmar wrote:
    ....what the dissertation's about ;-).
    ...?
    Freudian concept of the Uncanny in Jonathan Swift (related to englightenment, confidence in mind of man etc. etc. being where the Copernicus joke comes in). Found this quote some bloke called Bernard de Fontenelle (some people may have heard of him? - I hadn't!) said of Copernicus that “’Twas well done of him…, to abate the Vanity of Mankind, who had taken up the best place in the Universe” - which reminded me of the joke that I previously only knew as 'that one my mate said in the pub' - and hence my subsequent search for the origins.

    Edit: Don't know why I put "etc. etc." up there as if anyone and everyone should know about it... I'd have no idea if it wasn't in my uni course!

    Edited by Kolmar at 15:41:00 19-04-2006
  • Carlo 19 Apr 2006 15:42:59 21,382 posts
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    WarKitty wrote:
    Carlo wrote:
    WarKitty wrote:
    referencing Frasier should be sufficent, you could maybe even mention the dilemma of once speech enters general usage can it truely be 'owen' by anyone?
    What like the football player?

    I hate you.. metaphorically :p

    I almost went for:

    ---------------------------------------
    WarKitty wrote:
    referencing Frasier should be sufficent, you could maybe even mention the dilemma of once speech enters general usage can it truely be 'pwen' by anyone?
    Fixed
  • WarKitty 19 Apr 2006 15:44:01 566 posts
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    Carlo wrote:
    WarKitty wrote:
    Carlo wrote:
    WarKitty wrote:
    referencing Frasier should be sufficent, you could maybe even mention the dilemma of once speech enters general usage can it truely be 'owen' by anyone?
    What like the football player?

    I hate you.. metaphorically :p

    I almost went for:

    ---------------------------------------
    WarKitty wrote:
    referencing Frasier should be sufficent, you could maybe even mention the dilemma of once speech enters general usage can it truely be 'pwen' by anyone?
    Fixed

    I like that one :)
  • Carlo 19 Apr 2006 15:44:11 21,382 posts
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    Kolmar wrote:
    Carlo wrote:
    Kolmar wrote:
    ....what the dissertation's about ;-).
    ...?
    Freudian concept of the Uncanny in Jonathan Swift (related to englightenment, confidence in mind of man etc. etc. being where the Copernicus joke comes in). Found this quote some bloke called Bernard de Fontenelle (some people may have heard of him? - I hadn't!) said of Copernicus that “’Twas well done of him…, to abate the Vanity of Mankind, who had taken up the best place in the Universe” - which reminded me of the joke that I previously only knew as 'that one my mate said in the pub' - and hence my subsequent search for the origins.

    Edit: Don't know why I put "etc. etc." up there as if anyone and everyone should know about it... I'd have no idea if it wasn't in my uni course!

    Edited by Kolmar at 15:41:00 19-04-2006
    Got a draft you're happy to show yet?
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